FREE FULL FEATURE PCB LAYOUT W/AUTOROUTE

[Sean_Goddard]

Go here >> http://uk.rs-online.com/web/generalDisplay.html?id=pcb&cm_sp=Homepage-uk-_-designSpark-_-Secondary-Banner << and get it.

SWEET!!!

OR you could "google" "SONSIVRI", it's up to you.

[Qiaozhi]

Originally Posted by Sean_Goddard

Go here >> http://uk.rs-online.com/web/generalDisplay.html?id=pcb&cm_sp=Homepage-uk-_-designSpark-_-Secondary-Banner << and get it.

SWEET!!!

OR you could "google" "SONSIVRI", it's up to you.

Looks pretty slick!
But the best thing is that runs under Ubuntu using WINE. To be fair I've only had a cursory glance, but most Windoze programs either break during the installation, or everything goes horribly wrong quite soon after it starts. Looking good so far.

I particularly like the panning with the middle button. Most PCB programs are poor in this respect. But the example schematic that is displayed at the start has some capacitors marked as 1mF, which presumably should be 1uF. Anyway, I'll see how it goes on Ubuntu before commiting it to the Windoze box.

[Rov]

download from design spark,71Mb correct?will give it a try,Thanks for the Link!
Cheers! Rov

[moodz]

Originally Posted by Qiaozhi

Looks pretty slick!
But the best thing is that runs under Ubuntu using WINE. To be fair I've only had a cursory glance, but most Windoze programs either break during the installation, or everything goes horribly wrong quite soon after it starts. Looking good so far.

I particularly like the panning with the middle button. Most PCB programs are poor in this respect. But the example schematic that is displayed at the start has some capacitors marked as 1mF, which presumably should be 1uF. Anyway, I'll see how it goes on Ubuntu before commiting it to the Windoze box.

my 2 cents ... Eagle works fine under WINE.

[Tinkerer]

To offer a free full feature, unrestricted PCB layout is a splendid marketing strategy of RS. I am sure this will become the trend.

The world of marketing is changing fast. The businesses that stay in the forefront will be the winners. The ones who stay attached to obsolete marketing strategies will fade away.

I have downloaded the " http://www.designspark.com/" software and am giving it a fair try.

I will also include RS Components "http://uk.rs-online.com/web/", who offer this free PCB layout, in my list of favorite suppliers for future parts orders.

Tinkerer

And, many thanks Sean, for the link.

[simonbaker]

Thanks Sean! This looks like a great find.

We'll see how easy for me to learn...

-SB

[Eddy71]

Originally Posted by simonbaker

Thanks Sean! This looks like a great find.
We'll see how easy for me to learn...
-SB

http://www.pcb123.com/

[simonbaker]

Originally Posted by Eddy71

http://www.pcb123.com/

My god, an embarassment of riches! Anybody got time to compare all these? Does this one have a schematic capture program?

Sometimes these free products are great for sending your design to their manufacturing process, but not as flexible for do-it-yourself.

I use PCBExpress. It is good, but a couple of limitations. Some limitations in printing the PCB, no "mirror" printing which can have some uses. Also you can't import an image of a PCB as a background to copy.

-SB

[Qiaozhi]

Originally Posted by moodz

my 2 cents ... Eagle works fine under WINE.

Interesting ... I haven't tried Eagle in Linux. Or perhaps I did, in the past, and it wasn't successful.
I'll put it on the list for testing.

[simonbaker]

I just opened PCB123 and went to main schematic tab.

Do a component search for ".22 capacitor" and it crashes program (search by right-click on taxonomy tree root, or use search inside "Add Part" button).

Can anyone verify? Maybe bad download?

-SB

[moodz]

Originally Posted by Qiaozhi

Interesting ... I haven't tried Eagle in Linux. Or perhaps I did, in the past, and it wasn't successful.
I'll put it on the list for testing.

... 4 cents now .... LTSpice does as well ..... ..

[Qiaozhi]

Originally Posted by simonbaker

I just opened PCB123 and went to main schematic tab.

Do a component search for ".22 capacitor" and it crashes program (search by right-click on taxonomy tree root, or use search inside "Add Part" button).

Can anyone verify? Maybe bad download?

-SB

Yes, it crashes for me as well.

[simonbaker]

I'm finding PCB123 and DesignSpark both difficult so far in terms of locating parts. They seem to be "manufacturer-centric", in that I don't see how to locate a part unless you know the manufacturer code. Part descriptions seem lacking also... I searched for 7808 and got some hits, but when selecting the part, all I see is the footprint, but no description of what it is.

I'll keep trying since I'd like to see how the autoroute feature works, and I like the idea of two-way editing, where the PCB and schematic are kept in tight sync.

PCBExpress tools so far are easiest for me to whip up a schematic, but they cannot export netlists and formats to interface with other tools.

-SB

[simonbaker]

PCB123 seems immature product in many ways. Parts list very incomplete. Not even have basic transistors. Generic transistor only in TO 92 form factor. Seems they put more effort into ordering system and links to Digikey.

DesignSpark more intuitive, but still I'm having problems. Found a 2N2907 transistor and looks OK, but when I try to draw wires, get "net class" problem, don't understand. Will keep trying.

PCB123 says it is used by MIT etc, but they must customize parts I imagine. Also many buttons and items that badly need flyover text don't have it. Maybe will be better in a year or two.

However, I wait for others to say it is good and I'll keep trying.

-SB

[minime]

Hi to all!
DesignSpark is a real excellent program, as in reality is the wellknown Easy-PC from Number-One Systems (WestDev Ltd now). EasyPC PCB CAD is one of the first PCB CADs made (at 80's) and has proved its value all of these years! Most of the later pcb cad's have based their primary "knowledge" on it! There was even a period that the similarity of the Boardmaker with old DOS EasyPC at early 90's was unbelievable! A rumour was that the Boardmaker was created by soem of the EasyPC designers that have left the company at late 80's and did a new company. Don't know if that's true but the 2 programs seemed identical at the first period! And EasyPC was for sure by far the older one...
To work around it is easy, but as is always the case with everything new in our personal view, you'll need to do some reasearch first! All the above mentioned "problems" that I saw, can be easily overpassed if you devote some time to see every library contents before starting to search for a compnent. For example as is on EasyPC the standard linear Voltage regulators (78xx & 79xx) on DesignSpark can be found at the Library named "Hybrid.cml".
NET CLASS is something that you can define (if you haven't upload an example and then modify the design to see how it acts) by deciding if the net you want to add is normal signal, power signal or ground signal, etc. That is also related to the use of a min/max allowable trace (track) width when you convert NETs to tracks on a PCB. You can just define one NET class and work everything with that setting. But you can also make NET classes for every signal type in your design (ie, digital path, analog, power, RF, etc). Then you can also subdivide the NET class tracks in different min/max widths. That is a usefull setting if you want the Autorouter to be able to arrange the tracks widths by special demands and make it easier for it to work aound a heavy populated PCB, with tight spacings left for track routing. Take a tour at the Technology file settings. That can be viewed by opening "Settings" and selecting "Design Technology" from it. A screen will open that allows you to add/change any NET/TRACK/PAD & Text style you want! Remember that NET CLASS is general setting of NET types will be used in a design, while NET is a specific net setting for making different subclasses with min/max track widths & names!

[minime]

Cont:
If you like you can also import the default TECHNOLOGY FILE settings at your new design before add any component/net at it. To do so, you should again open "SETTINGS" from menu bar, then click on "TECHNOLOGY TRANSFER" and a window will open. That will have the related tasks used in this new design, for Pad, text, Line, Track, Net, & Netclass styles! You may see that almost all are empty in the side where it is refered to the "... styles in current design". To add the DEFAULT settings you must choose from the existing tech files the "NAME" of the Technology file (probably empty at first time of use) you want to load. Now select the "Default.stf" and you will see that at the right lower part "Styles in Technology file" they will appear the presets used at it. Click on "COPY ALL" button and they will appear also at the left side! Repeat this for every task (NET, track, etc)! Now you re ready to add compnents & nets at them to proceed without any "NET CLASS" warning messages!

Devote 2-3 hours playing around the settings and libraries of the DesignSpak. After that time you should be able to design on the fly, something!

It is pitty that while the program is the EasyPC CAD renamed for RS marketing purposes, hasn't the ability to accept EasyPC designs and libraries! That is also a vice versa situation fro EasyPC! It is weird that they prefer to accept Eagle files & libraries at both EasyPC & DesignSpark programs and NOT to allow users of EasyPC WHO HAVE PAID FOR IT (many thousand sterlins in all these years), to use DesignSpark for their clients, or to accept the schematics & boards (with the associated libraries) made with DesignSpark by a client of them! That is something that i thing it will be Trojan horse for the EasyPC sales! I for example I;m a bit frustrated by that act! I have paid EasyPC from DOS versions and followed ALL the upgrades (with EasyPC for windows) until now! Why do I have to pay newer upgrades when the exact same program under a "renamed version" is free and complete with many things that even my $$$$ professional EasyPC version doesn't have?

[Tinkerer]

minime, you make some good points.

• Why should we, students or amateurs, pay thousands of dollars for software when we can get it free somewhere else?
• Is the software really free? or are there strings attached? A software that obliges you to order your PCB's from an expensive manufacturer is really not free.

Below is a link to FARNELL's response to the RS COMPONENTS marketing move.
http://click.e-marketing.premierfarn...d59c5b50c264e2

FARNELL is an important international parts supplier who now offers a special edition of EAGLE.

These marketing schemes by major electronics part suppliers are really clever and show how global the electronics market has become.
I am sure that the supplying of FREE PCB and simulation software will greatly enhance the sales of these companies in the long run.

Tinkerer

[simonbaker]

Thanks minime for the tips. I'm still not clear on the net class thing. I just added some components to my schematic, but it will not let me connect them because no net class, yet it doesn't help me know what to do. I'll read some more, but a little frustrating that you can't just connect your components by default.

I agree with your upgrade/compatibility frustrations. It looks like they care more about stealing Eagle users than taking care of their loyal customers...

Regards,

-SB

[ANDREAS]

Hi all
I want say something. After install Designspark my PC and try with this.. i see it's difficult (same orgad). I am a fine user Orcad, but it's impossible for me study again software for electronics circuits. Simple user-panel for me is better for all. I am commercial designer, after many-many years with Eagle, orcad.etc.. better for all is expresspcb,This is my opinions and never say is better for you, if you like work with other software. With this i can make parts with my opinions without libraries etc
Never has problem from build prototype PCB with expresspcb. Autorouter? i don't like use. Only for me a poor point is exprot gerber file.
Here i want your help.
I listen, there is a free software for mark point-holes inside a PDF file with mouse and then this software calculate export a gerber file. If this is true..please send me a PM.
Thanks for your time

[simonbaker]

Originally Posted by minime

Cont:
If you like you can also import the default TECHNOLOGY FILE settings at your new design before add any component/net at it. To do so, you should again open "SETTINGS" from menu bar, then click on "TECHNOLOGY TRANSFER" and a window will open. That will have the related tasks used in this new design, for Pad, text, Line, Track, Net, & Netclass styles! You may see that almost all are empty in the side where it is refered to the "... styles in current design". To add the DEFAULT settings you must choose from the existing tech files the "NAME" of the Technology file (probably empty at first time of use) you want to load. Now select the "Default.stf" and you will see that at the right lower part "Styles in Technology file" they will appear the presets used at it. Click on "COPY ALL" button and they will appear also at the left side! Repeat this for every task (NET, track, etc)! Now you re ready to add compnents & nets at them to proceed without any "NET CLASS" warning messages!

Devote 2-3 hours playing around the settings and libraries of the DesignSpak. After that time you should be able to design on the fly, something!

It is pitty that while the program is the EasyPC CAD renamed for RS marketing purposes, hasn't the ability to accept EasyPC designs and libraries! That is also a vice versa situation fro EasyPC! It is weird that they prefer to accept Eagle files & libraries at both EasyPC & DesignSpark programs and NOT to allow users of EasyPC WHO HAVE PAID FOR IT (many thousand sterlins in all these years), to use DesignSpark for their clients, or to accept the schematics & boards (with the associated libraries) made with DesignSpark by a client of them! That is something that i thing it will be Trojan horse for the EasyPC sales! I for example I;m a bit frustrated by that act! I have paid EasyPC from DOS versions and followed ALL the upgrades (with EasyPC for windows) until now! Why do I have to pay newer upgrades when the exact same program under a "renamed version" is free and complete with many things that even my $$$$ professional EasyPC version doesn't have?

Hi minime:

I tried to do what you said, but there are no ".stf" files in my installation.

Am I missing something?

Regards,

-SB

[simonbaker]

I worked through the tutorial pdf for DesignSpark and am happier with it.

When starting a new schematic, if you're a beginner, it is important to check the "Use Technology File" checkbox and choose default.stf . I don't think you'll find a default.stf file anywhere in your files.

The tutorial was quite good, a few errors here and there.

For me, setting component values didn't work as described in the tutorial.

According to the tutorial, you have to double-click the component or component label, select the "Values" tab, and fill in a parameter called "Value". But for me, the parameter wasn't there. I had to add it by clicking the "Add" button to add a parameter, name the new parameter "Value", fill in the value of the parameter, then checkmark the new "Value" parameter so it will show on the schematic. That's a lot of hoops to jump for a very frequent operation. There must be a better way I'm missing, but that's what my installation required.

When adding a "TO" schema component (labeled connection to another point on the schematic without running wire), they say to right-click it and choose "Display" to see the net-name you give it. Actually, you need to right-click on the wire you connect the "TO" component to to choose the display option.

The parts list seems good. You need to get to know your libraries. The main ones to get started are "discreet" (generic parts), and "schema" (special schematic objects). The search "ALL" works well though for finding components.

I didn't see any tool for checking your schematic for unconnected pins or other connection problems. ExpressSCH has that.

The autoplacer/autorouter makes lots of jumpers on the top side of a double-sided board. I don't know how useful it is.

Overall it looks like a pretty good program. PCB123 seemed more limited, but if anyone has good things to say about it, always interested to hear.

-SB