XP deus coil modification

[Henrikras]

In some of your photos I could see a thin Black line in the potting.

This is additional graphite layer - The layer had a drain wire. So the original coil bundle had graphite on 4 sides like screen box.

It also had a drain wire above and a drain wire below coil bundle.[ATTACH]29031[/ATTACH]

BUT Gulfnut - I made all that, just like the Deus coil....

[golfnut]

In some of your photos I could see a thin Black line in the potting.

This is additional graphite layer - The layer had a drain wire. So the original coil bundle had graphite on 4 sides like screen box.

It also had a drain wire above and a drain wire below coil bundle.

[Henrikras]

Hi,

Slow it up a bit like Skippy said - as the coils are not totally potted they will move in a fast sweep and false.

You have not finished the Graphite BOX shape on 4 sides of the coil bundle - So the gound is Visible to the coil - only this now... |_|

When 4 sided conductive box you will mirror XP original - they also had drain wire where you have currently no screen. ( the drain wire requires good connection to the graphite/carbon.


Would you BOB the coil over clean earth to see if the autp ground balance is functioning correctly..

In Lab, does it reject Ferrite effectively - I didnt see in test results?

Steve

Dear Steve...

Okay I will find 2 gear and take it easy a little... You and Skippy could Be right about ist only 24-36 hours ago ist Potted.
But please- could you explain this Once more please... "Not finished the graphite box shape.........???????"

The GB is working perfectly... (Seem to so fare) - try tracking and manuel, it looks to stay calm. !!! The pump isn't good at the Deus, so that will never help us.

Its Maybee a good idea to wait until saturday with more work... A kind of panic from my side..

Thanks.

Henrik.

[Henrikras]

HERE IS SOME ANSWERS

I'll try first.
Is your Li cell fully charged? I'm sure it is, but... YES - CLOSE TO 100%


I don't think your graphite paint resistance is too high, it should be fine. It matches what George Payne says ( I will find the link).


Is your short cable fixed? I know it's short, but there are cases of 'noisy' cable, that have microphony, (the Blisstool had this, I think?).
NO THIS IS NOT A PROBLEM


Is there any accidental connection between the shield/paint and any of the 4 main wires? I don't know how you can measure this, unless you can disconnect the shield wire from the RX negative. Just use a ohm meter.
I HAVE CAREFULL TO KEEP A DISTANCE.


Am I correct in saying that on this build, you don't have a seperate shield around the RX, to isolate it from the TX?
NO - LIKE ANSWERED EARLYER


One unknown, I mentioned early in the thread is: The Deus thinks it has a BIG coil on it, not a small one, so it may be doing something different because of this. Such as different time-constants in filters, or different gain/sensitivity settings. I can't think why this would cause problems. If anything, I would expect sensitivity to be lower.
THIS COULD BE THE PROBLEM TO GET THE LAST 5-10% STILL MISSING.


How rigid do you think your coil is? VERY RIGID? Does swinging it away from the ground (like 60cm away) cause problems? NO
The amount of signal change from the coil needed to trigger the machine is TINY. That 15 mV pk-pk needs to change just 10 microvolts (maybe less) and it will signal. Do you get false signals if you 'pump' the coil up and down ( way away from the ground, > 1metre) .
NO FALSE SIGNALS - THE CABLE ALLSO STRIPSED.


Does the null still read 15mV out in the open? Drag your scope outside and see. THAT WILL BE IN DAYLIGHT.

[golfnut]

Hi,

Slow it up a bit like Skippy said - as the coils are not totally potted they will move in a fast sweep and false.

You have not finished the Graphite BOX shape on 4 sides of the coil bundle - So the gound is Visible to the coil - only this now... |_|

When 4 sided conductive box you will mirror XP original - they also had drain wire where you have currently no screen. ( the drain wire requires good connection to the graphite/carbon.


Would you BOB the coil over clean earth to see if the autp ground balance is functioning correctly..

In Lab, does it reject Ferrite effectively - I didnt see in test results?

Steve

[Henrikras]

Thank you Once more.... Just been out - painted more graphite and down to 400-600 ohm, but still spots with 1.0-1.5 Kohm..
THAT gave a Big different in the right direction. Close to the goal now.

Sorry about this bad quality video. just recorded it outside with the phone. Hope you can hear that the signals are more clear.
link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sfr3V6KGFBI&sns=em

This is the video Shortly after, measuring the graphite resistance... Pretty low I would say.
Link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hlzQZp1xv0E&sns=em

Henrik

[Skippy]

Here is the George Payne article where he talks about coil shielding (at the end):
http://jb-ms.com/Baron/gb.htm

[Henrikras]

Thanks Skippy... That some good ideas to work with.

This quenstretion : Am I correct in saying that on this build, you don't have a seperate shield around the RX, to isolate it from the TX?
NO - the RX and the TX are not seperated !!! That would had been the third shield type, wouldn't it !

I will go to the lab now and try something - to come closer to something usefull.

Henrik.

[Skippy]

I'll try first.
Is your Li cell fully charged? I'm sure it is, but...

I don't think your graphite paint resistance is too high, it should be fine. It matches what George Payne says ( I will find the link).

Is your short cable fixed? I know it's short, but there are cases of 'noisy' cable, that have microphony, (the Blisstool had this, I think?).

Is there any accidental connection between the shield/paint and any of the 4 main wires? I don't know how you can measure this, unless you can disconnect the shield wire from the RX negative. Just use a ohm meter.

Am I correct in saying that on this build, you don't have a seperate shield around the RX, to isolate it from the TX?

One unknown, I mentioned early in the thread is: The Deus thinks it has a BIG coil on it, not a small one, so it may be doing something different because of this. Such as different time-constants in filters, or different gain/sensitivity settings. I can't think why this would cause problems. If anything, I would expect sensitivity to be lower.

How rigid do you think your coil is? Does swinging it away from the ground (like 60cm away) cause problems? The amount of signal change from the coil needed to trigger the machine is TINY. That 15 mV pk-pk needs to change just 10 microvolts (maybe less) and it will signal. Do you get false signals if you 'pump' the coil up and down ( way away from the ground, > 1metre) .

Does the null still read 15mV out in the open? Drag your scope outside and see.

[Henrikras]

LATEST NEWs about the Deus 7" coil...
Oh my god - why shall it Be SO difficult!
Situation - Its working perfect in lab, but outside the soil / ground is Breaking up the signals, just like deep and weak targets at the Stock coil, but with my homemade coil allso bigger object close to the coil, they or not clear.. Like there is interference from the ground, or like the ground is making iron signals mixed with goodies I had dig down.
air test outside - perfect. All the disc. \ ID's are same like the Stock coil, allso perfect.

This utube is made before the bottom shielding - but it tells Very Well the problem. Listen to the silver coin - like iron arround it.
link. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YUOK1MVXM6k&sns=em

1. I can't get into my mind, that I got a phase problem - Its working in lab. - !
2. Its must Be shielding problems and EMI / ground interference problem - !
3. Could it Be that the Graphite I use, is the wrong type ?? - Or I did something wrong doing the shielding ?
4. Could it Be that my 1.5 Kohm is to high... Even the Stock coil was measured 1.5 Kohm. ? (Graphite type, drain wire - different )
5. Could it that I made a mistake, when I found out the Shielding drain wire was connected to the RX cold side at the Stock coil,
and some how XP did it different, just dont know how.

Hope you got some VERY good ideas... I'm in trouble.

Henrik.