DEEPERS

[Fred]

I noticed one interesting thing; usually early in the morning, when sun is just about to rise , Minelab Colt is working like beast.

This is like a bomb in the LRL world ... you have to dig this !

[ivconic]

Yes, mostly depends of soil iself. In some soils item can not be detected even at 1/2 of depths, which usually should on some other soils.
Another factor are weather conditions, moisture, daytime etc..etc..
I noticed one interesting thing; usually early in the morning, when sun is just about to rise , Minelab Colt is working like beast. As sun rised and warm up the place, Minelab is less and less sensitive. Especially on places directly under the sun. Than i usually change the place and walk into forest to void direct strikes of the sun. Deeply in the forest, under the tree, Colt is working again very deep. So...
It is hard to compare even a same detector on much different soils and under different working conditions. So our comparsions and tests are not enough authoritative and universal. Each one of us is having own truth and experience.
Regards!

[Alexismex]

Ivconic, Good test when you are in the field, I believe you but I remenber some i test master hunter 7 with 10 coil ,white 5900 with 10 , Tesoro and for ultimate the Tejon with 10 ovoide coil none give a good response...i know my ground is medium to high mineralised ..i think it is the explanation !!!

[WM6]

At what distance do the different detectors find these alu foil targets "In Air"
or buried in the ground?

Tinkerer

As standard coin for soil testing I use silver coin 30mm dia, and for air testing small gold coin 7mm dia 0.3gm.

One example of soil test. Fairly uniform in buried beer can test, detectors by coin test significant differentiate. Whites Matrix M6 equipped with 12 cm Excelerator coil detect silver coin in soil almost 1/3 deeper than some other detectors with double (e.g. 22cm) coil.

[Tinkerer]

Testing standard

Alexismex, as I already wrote, I dig a vertical hole of about 60 cm placed into an (empty!!) 0,33l can of beer and re-fill hole with soil. A few years ago and this is my basic test point to test whether the detector work (worth) or not. All previously tested detectors with coils over 20 cm through successfully (some more others less convincingly) to overcome this test. For coins I have designed a special test plant and I can say only that there is no rule which would ensure that the performance in beer can detecting would be repeated in coins. But maybe can is good reference for "militaria" searching.

I like the alu can as a testing standard for large targets. It is quite universal. A steel can of about similar size can serve as test target to see if the detector discriminates to full depth.

Universal standards for smaller targets are more difficult to find, because coins vary very much in their metal alloys.
A fairly reliable standard seems to be alu foil. Using the thin kitchen alu foil, cut to one inch square should be possible in most parts of the world.

An even smaller target is a one inch square piece of foil cut in half.

At what distance do the different detectors find these alu foil targets "In Air"
or buried in the ground?

Tinkerer

[WM6]

Good guys, just tell me please if you are using a "offset hole " like the description i make???

Alexismex, as I already wrote, I dig a vertical hole of about 60 cm placed into an (empty!!) 0,33l can of beer and re-fill hole with soil. A few years ago and this is my basic test point to test whether the detector work (worth) or not. All previously tested detectors with coils over 20 cm through successfully (some more others less convincingly) to overcome this test. For coins I have designed a special test plant and I can say only that there is no rule which would ensure that the performance in beer can detecting would be repeated in coins. But maybe can is good reference for "militaria" searching.

[ivconic]

My Garrett XL 500 (when it was working )
With 33cm coil and the little 5k resistor mod detects
coke can .......................................... 90cm(veryvery faint 95)
20 australian cent coin........................ 40cm

No wonder. XL 500 is pretty descent PI machine. I think it can perform even better on some other types of soils.

[Micheal]

My Garrett XL 500 (when it was working )
With 33cm coil and the little 5k resistor mod detects
coke can .......................................... 90cm(veryvery faint 95)
20 australian cent coin........................ 40cm

[ivconic]

Good guys, just tell me please if you are using a "offset hole " like the description i make???

Not really (in my case). I dont think is relevant to exactly discover behavior on such item like cola can. I took cola can along with several other items and burried into soil in my backyard. So holes are straight. Items are covered with soil again. That's in case if we are speaking of ordinary testing. Not relevant.
But what is really relevant is live experience from real terrains. So many times i had "luck" to dug huge and deep holes and later to discover cola can or simillar Al rubbish! As i pointed; ploughts! Ploughts are soils very often processed by farmers. Plow in process of furrow can go very deep, depends of type and destination, but usually from 40 to 80cm. Usuall ploughts i am visiting are near by the river. Soil there is very mealy. It is pretty often case to discover some item very deep, over the 1m in soil. Usually those items are large and heavy. Usually made from massive iron or massive Al (various Al cans, dish,pan...etc...etc).
So... plenty of simillar experiences. Summing all those experiences in conjution to experiences gained on my test field, i know,i tested and i am 100% positive that cola can is very easy to be detected at 60, 80 and even 100cm in soil. Mostly depends on detector type. As i said; Atlantis Imperator II, White's Spectrum and Colt with 10" coil are easilly detect those. No problem at all. Atlantis is very deep but suffers from other drawbacks; like slow (very slow) recovery speed and certain instabillity under certain conditions. Colt is real killer on such items and larger the coil i attach to it - easier detection at huge depths. Do i need to mention that i also have 36cm and 45cm coils for it? You just dont want to hear achieved depths with those coil, trust me! I dare to say here, cose than many members here will take me as a crackpot, so i better not say what i gained with 45cm coil and Colt.
But most illustrative should be White's Spectrum. It is easy checkable anywhere on the world, at any soil. Boosted to run pretty "hot", Spectrum is extra deep detector - real beast! Cola can on 60cm in soil (plought - like, soil) is a joke for Spectrum! I can only imagine what should we gain with newest Spectra!??? Hopefully in time we will get some reports from happy owners..
Cheers!

[Alexismex]

Good guys, just tell me please if you are using a "offset hole " like the description i make???

[ivconic]

Yes it is for to be expected some nice PI to detect it also. No wonder.
Regards!

Zivio WM6!

[WM6]

But...IB's - not PI's. About PI's i am not sure. Maybe PI's on higher frequencies. Most probably.

Ivconic, I can testify about CS4PI which owned. CS4PI detect 0,33l beer can buried in 60cm hole (buried some years ago only for basic test purposes) even by moving about 20cm over surface. As you say, maybe it is "frequency" (changeable between 1000 to 4200 pulses /ps) that affect in deep, by relatively small coil, I don't know. But my homemade PI (coil 32cm) clearly detect this can too. CS4PI, unfortunately, is quite unstable (often chatter).

Alexismex I do not know much about Mexican soil, but I proven know that "can tests" and "coin tests" does not always provide comparable results (sometimes surprisingly different).

During tests all detectors are equipped with standard coils (most between 22 and 25 cm).

And yes, Chinese TS150 (otherwise sensitive to the wet grass) pass this test too. Here you are:

http://www.netzwerk-lan.com/produkt/282/Metall_Detector_fuer_den_Untergrund_Alltest_TS150. htm

[ivconic]

Ah yes; turkish Atlantis Imperator II can easilly detect Al can at over the 80cm in soil, beleive or not. I tested it many times to show to my friends. No problem at all. Last year i had White's Spectrum - same results on Al cans and simillar garbage in soil. This year i tested also Minelab Explorer SE. With Excellerator DD 35x25cm coil Explorer can detect Cola can at over the 1m in soil with extra strong signal! Extra,extra strong signal!
So...it is not a problem at all to detect Al cans in soil at higher depths. It is problem to detect single (valueable) coin in simillar conditions!

[ivconic]

Alexismex you'll be very suprised, you better beleive. Coke can or simillar Al can is giving extra strong signal at many detectors (IB's of course).
I can justify WM6's claims, simply cose i do have same experiences.
It is not about "beleive" or not. I guess it is about different make up of soils here in Europe and there at your place.
That's why i am oftenly pissed of - to many simillar Al garbage in soil here. I exhaust my self digging such very "good" signals and finally discover .... Al can or whatever simillar. And mostly at higher depths, 40,50,60cm and more. Especially in ploughts!
No matter how good discrimination is at some model, such Al garbage is almost impossible to discriminate. This is pretty often case - that's why i do remember it good!
Dont know about many other models, but i am 100% sure that White's M6 so as my Musketeer Colt (10"coil) and simillar can easilly detect Cola can at 60cm in soil. No problem at all.
But...IB's - not PI's. About PI's i am not sure. Maybe PI's on higher frequencies. Most probably.
Regards!

[Alexismex]

Hello ,
I personally don´t believe you....did not want to go on polemic discussion but at 65cm in medium mineral ground with a "offset hole" ...you make a 65cm deep hole and in the bottom you make a transverse hole and here you put you coke can and test above ...

don´t believe because i make the "TRUE OFFSET TEST" with many vlf detector the lastest i check ...the Tejon here in the mineral ground of Mexico did not have any signal with Vlf detector ...
And did not speak of chinese Vlf not possible to adjust to the mineral ground
Alexis.