White's is closing

[Qiaozhi]

The buy through a local "dealer ship" and not international "resellers" is plain stupid, if you want stock to sell, then sell it to whoever wants to buy it, who will be the next to go

If you have a company that has an established business selling through distributors, then it is difficult to switch over to a direct selling model. The first thing that happens is that the distributors will hate you, and will rubbish your products in favour of the other products they have on offer. On the other hand, distributors are a fickle bunch anyway, and will tend to sell whatever makes them the most profit. There are pluses and minuses to both approaches. IMHO, direct selling gives you better control, but requires more staff. Whereas distribution effectively gives you a larger sales force, but each sale is at a reduced profit per detector.
The best approach would be to offer direct sales, without somehow upsetting the distribution chain.

[6666]

The buy through a local "dealer ship" and not international "resellers" is plain stupid, if you want stock to sell, then sell it to whoever wants to buy it, who will be the next to go

[Kev]

I think I understand some of what Carl is eluding too.
A few years back I stumbled on the Whites' website, and it seemed fantastic all the bits and pieces you could purchase.
i selected a couple of full shafts assemblies, plastic nut&bolts and coil covers, (I used covers to make coils as I was making flat spirals at the time) but when I went to pay, it said it didn't sell out of the Continental US, purchase form your local dealer.
Well we didn't have a local dealer here in New Zealand at the time, I don't even know if we have one now, certainly not for much longer it seems.
I see how this dealer model would have stopped them from making a lot more ready cash, I had it in hand, but they couldn't take it because of the outdated supply model they had chained themselves to.

I would've bought quite a few shafts from them, the prices were realistic, but it put me off Whites all together. I have bought quite a few parts directly from Minelab, such as coil connectors, screws, even a mylar harness for my 4500. Whites could've make an exception for replacement parts just like Minelab, since they use the dealer model too but a more realistic one.

Cheers
Kev.

[Kemper]

It doesn't matter that Whites is going out of business. There are plenty of other manufacturers around. They made money and whoever holds the assets now will sell them and make money.

People take the availability and performance of machine way too seriously. I have an ACE 250 and an Equinox. I prefer to use the ACE 250 most of the time. Any new technology that has come out in the last 10 years has not made anyone a better treasure hunter than they would be if they spent the time learning and playing with machines actually going out and hunting for treasure.

One forum that calls itself a " metal detecting forum " is really not much more than a metal detector forum. That emphasizes most what the problem is with social media and it's relation to the hobby. Whites may be leaving the hobby because the hobby left them.

[kt315]

Kemper in whites forum i gave people some schematics of multitone mods on 5900 - 6000 di pro sl. whites deleted my posts and banned this thread.
no sorry to whites.
you can compare an answer of whites with chinese one. feel difference.

https://www.geotech1.com/forums/showthread.php?23513-angry-american-miss-Hudson-of-Whites-company-vs-chinese-pretty-lady-Lisa-who-win

[Kemper]

When the MX Sport came out there were problems with the first run. We were talking about it at Dankowski forum with a Whites representative that said he would be answering our questions. He only answered the questions he wanted to answer. I was pushing for them to recall the first run as they all had inferior parts. When I kept pushing for a recall and wanting serial numbers of the first run posted the Dankowski mob attacked me. When that happened, I,on another thread said that Dankowski forum sucks and it did and still does.

There was an opportunity there to push for what was the right thing to do ( recall ) and post serial numbers to avoid these machines being out in the open market. To this day you can not be assured you don't have an inferior ,first run MX Sport. I think issues surrounding the MX Sport hurt the Whites company more than anything else in recent years.

Forums can be good for doing positive things for the detecting community. Whites chose to go to Dankowski forum where money is always a priority over what is best for the hobby. Dankowski didn't ban the representative from Whites for coming on the forum and lying to the members about asking questions. Dankowski let Whites use his forum to try to get past the MX Sport debacle without doing what they should have for the consumers.
Dankowski banned me for trying to have accomplished what would have been best for the detecting community.

[Carl-NC]

If a company announces it is stepping out of business, the products are bound to go down in prices (no support).
I think they loose trust and it is a bad choice. Why didn't they keep quiet about this - keep couple of guys on a payroll I just don't get it. Or perhaps they did for quite a while and kept quiet?

I think it's a credit to White's to make the announcement. Tesoro did what you suggest, they just laid off everyone and closed without an official notice. Ticked off a lot of people. And everyone knew right away as ex-employees posted it on forums. Can't keep something like that a secret.

[Carl-NC]

Whites just ooze QUALITY and performance but their continued attempts to produce low end machines to rival the Garrett Ace series have been nothing but junk. IMHO the Classic was a great machine. Who needs TID on a cheap machine? THe WHOLE points of a switch on and go like the Classic is that you DON'T know what you are going to dig up, and THAT is the WHOLE point of metal detecting, the thrill that it just MIGHT be a rare coin but could just as easily be junk.

Actually, the Prizm series came out just before the Ace 250 and slightly outperformed the Ace. That the Ace took off and captured the market is precisely due to the fact that White's was still embracing the disty/dealer model and Garrett embraced the Internet. And, yes, TID was and is necessary to compete in that market. Just ask Tesoro.

Whites have basically FAILED to exploint the security and industrial markets and there is too much competition from China to survive in the hobby market alone.

When I joined White's the #1 priority project was a walk-thru security detector. I got it finished and even built a production line for it. It was ready to sell but as I was leaving the company, they decided to cancel the whole thing.

[eclipse]

If a company announces it is stepping out of business, the products are bound to go down in prices (no support).
I think they loose trust and it is a bad choice. Why didn't they keep quiet about this - keep couple of guys on a payroll I just don't get it. Or perhaps they did for quite a while and kept quiet?

[Sean_Goddard]

I've had my Eagle Spectrum since the day they were released in the uk and it's STILL the best machine going. I also have an ETrac. For build the Spectrum wipes the floor with ANYTHING Minelab had to offer. On the beach, the ETrac wins hands down. Inland I'd say the Spectrum is better as it is much more predicatble although depth wise, the ETrac is easily twice what the Spectrum can get (and the Spectrum is damned deep).

Whites just ooze QUALITY and performance but their continued attempts to produce low end machines to rival the Garrett Ace series have been nothing but junk. IMHO the Classic was a great machine. Who needs TID on a cheap machine? THe WHOLE points of a switch on and go like the Classic is that you DON'T know what you are going to dig up, and THAT is the WHOLE point of metal detecting, the thrill that it just MIGHT be a rare coin but could just as easily be junk.

Whites have basically FAILED to exploint the security and industrial markets and there is too much competition from China to survive in the hobby market alone. That said though, most Chinese machines (even the clones) are simply CRAP, nothing more, nothing less (sorry China)

[Hamid]

That’s so sad I hope they will come back to producing soon.

Well, Undoubtedly, White’s Electronics made great metal detectors across the 70 years. I have to admit the cheapest whites metal detectors defeat lot of metal detectors.

[ivconic]

The industrial market is huge, or was until Covid-19. There are already companies in the UK who make industrial detectors for mines, quarries, recycling plants, sawmills, food, textiles, fishing, hospital laundries; the list goes on. I used to make Woodtec for timber scanning and Vettec for cows and other animals that swallow metal.

This is really for another thread for potential markets, other than hobby. I also think it would be useful for me to make a list of developments I have been involved it that never got into production, or were still only in concept form. Some think that PI has reached the end of it's development, but I would question that as I know there is so much more that can be done.

Eric

Please start new topic and disclose Vettec as much as you can.
I am interested in that part.
I would like to make some comparisons to my experiences so far.

[Ferric Toes]

The industrial market is huge, or was until Covid-19. There are already companies in the UK who make industrial detectors for mines, quarries, recycling plants, sawmills, food, textiles, fishing, hospital laundries; the list goes on. I used to make Woodtec for timber scanning and Vettec for cows and other animals that swallow metal.

This is really for another thread for potential markets, other than hobby. I also think it would be useful for me to make a list of developments I have been involved it that never got into production, or were still only in concept form. Some think that PI has reached the end of it's development, but I would question that as I know there is so much more that can be done.

Eric

[dbanner]

China is not to be blamed at all.

[ivconic]

Eric i think you are most competent one to say last word on this idea.
Since i experimented a lot trying to design such detector.
I tried all known technologies.
Only PI can do the job.
Demands are known, maximal distance is 30-32cm.
Objects are 5-10cm long, thin rusty irons and steel mostly.
Sometimes barbwire mesh.
Coil preferably smaller diameter, say 20-25cm at most.
Shaft short integrated with handle.
Easy operation, less possible knobs.
Non motion preferable.
Slow SAT. Slowest possible.
One simple battery supply. Preferably 9V. Or two.
Those are professionals. They need simplest possible but effective tool.