PI CHIP

[Stefan]

Hi Sid,

The artwork is for a positive photo resist board. The artwork film Farnel part number that I gave is for an inkjet printer and works well as long as you make a double up the positive artwork for each side as Ian explained. I use Kinsten Positive resist boards and these give excellent results. Ian uses Kalex D/Sided Positive resist boards and his boards turn out very well also. You are able to insert IC sockets and solder in place at bottom as i have not used the top pads as connection points. The OP amp if you use it needs to be soldered in place. If not used just link out the pin to connect through. I'll attach a photo of the completed board with sockets installed just to give an idea of how the board completes.
Regards,

Stefan

[sido]

For the scope and purpose of a experimenting, there is no need for Pro boards made to order.

Agree with IBGold and Stefan that this design can be made at home if you combine the 2 Negative Artworks to line up before exposing to UV light.

Keep the vias in check...line them up between top and bottom negative artwork and...keep some sort of corner reference for aligning the variables for the 2 layered copper tracks which should line up. providing you are combining vias and a corner reference which will do the trick

It's just a process of adding a piece of wire for the vias on both sides, after all is aligned and ready to go.

Cheer's and thank's

Sid

[ODM]

I believe someone already proposed seeedstudio (yes, with 3 'e' letters) and their fusion pcb service. 25 dollars for ten pieces of max 100x100mm board for example, double sided with mask and print, and some 5-8 dollars for shipping. They don't do paneling, but you can get boards machined and drilled to shape. They do flying lead testing for a minimum 50% of the run, but for through hole parts and track widths there is practically negligible risk of process errors.

[IBGold]

To add to Stefan's reply when doing the boards I laser print to film direct from Designspark I do two copy's of each side then glue the two prints of each side together using craft glue then I glue the two sides together on three sides making an envelope making sure in all gluing operations that all the holes are lined up perfectly then I slip in the Kalex D/Sided photosensitive board and expose to UV in my D/Sided light box I made my exposure time is one minute then I develop the boards and etch once set up it is quite easy but exposure time varies greatly dependant on the light source on my old light box which was S/Sided with fluro lights it took 16 minutes a side which was a pain.

Regards, Ian

[Pete the Builder]

Guys, I'm happy to do proper double-sided boards for you at cost. That means solder-masked (easy to solder with much less chance of accidental connections) plus silk-screened so you can just use the board itself to see where the components go. That also means if the proto works, you can safely take it out in the field. All the vias are properly made, and everything is solder-flashed so it's dead easy to solder.

The only issue might be the cost - for a single board, you're looking at (very roughly!) USD$0.65 per square inch, plus $25 setup cost, plus $24 soldermask and silkscreen. That usually works out to about USD$55 per board, one off. If say 6 people want boards, you break it down to about $15-$25 per person per board! Obviously, the more the merrier, but life doesn't usually work out that way.

What I'm proposing to do (and I'll post a proper thread/article later today) is to join in and get a board done myself for each project here, which will a) halve the price for a prototype for people like me who really can't afford the outlay, and b) have a duplicate ready if anyone needs a second board, or wants to get involved themselves. Plus, I'm about to get a whole bunch of my own boards made up, so I'm going to be able to just attach other pcb designs to that mess 'o boards, which will make it even cheaper. Details to follow. (I'm off to another specialist again. Whee. Who knew there were so many? And now I'm on the fast track!)

There are cheaper places out there (check out the back pages of Silicon Chip magazine, there are 3 or 4 Australian-based small board fabricators), but I like the quality of the guys at Futurlec. They use ETT in Thailand, and you're welcome to check them out yourselves.

Anyway, back to scheduled programming. I didn't mean to hijack the thread...
-PtB

[sido]

Hi Sid,

I made the board with the intent on using as a prototyping platform. I have added an OP amp buffer to give 5 v rail to rail swing for the analogue inputs and also buffered the digital outputs to protect the 4011. When playing it's more than probable that you will blow up something so at least the 4011 is protected to a degree.

Some of the components for the PCB design I had to build myself. There are more vias than necessary for a production run but for a prototype as you are making the boards at home the extra vias make the board more prototype friendly during construction. I have allowed enough clearance between tracks and ground planes so the board can be made at home.

I use the following sheets from Farnel ( Element14) 413-8090. Ian can give you a run down on how he made the boards. They do turn out ok.

Regards,

Stefan

Hi Stefan, thanks for the added info.

I thought that the missing components were due to me not having made them for designspark.
As you have created them.

Would like a basic run down to achieving similar results. I would give it a try but if i mess things up, either
i would start over again or send it out to a Forum member who offered for some board's to be made previously.
In saying this i would like to learn though.

Thank's Sid

[Stefan]

Hi Sid,

I made the board with the intent on using as a prototyping platform. I have added an OP amp buffer to give 5 v rail to rail swing for the analogue inputs and also buffered the digital outputs to protect the 4011. When playing it's more than probable that you will blow up something so at least the 4011 is protected to a degree.

Some of the components for the PCB design I had to build myself. There are more vias than necessary for a production run but for a prototype as you are making the boards at home the extra vias make the board more prototype friendly during construction. I have allowed enough clearance between tracks and ground planes so the board can be made at home.

I use the following sheets from Farnel ( Element14) 413-8090. Ian can give you a run down on how he made the boards. They do turn out ok.

Regards,

Stefan

[sido]

Once you open the schematic and PCB files in Designspark, click on BOM and PCB Quote, on the upper right corner. I think it would be interesting and helpful to less skilled designers, if we discuss and comment a bit on the actual parts, the prices etc. while using actual supplier's information.

Tinkerer

Hi Tinkerer. I tried doing the BOM request and half the parts were missing.
You are correct in that discussing sources and prices for the components. Most if not all can be purchased fron RS Components and Element 14. Some parts are probably already sitting in your junk box.

I created a thread in General Electronics where i have recycled alot of parts from dissued Electronics Boards. Components removed were 40 pin ic sockets, pin header's, OEM ic 4558's etc etc.

http://www.geotech1.com/forums/showthread.php?20219-Recycled-old-PCB-board-s

Thanks once again Ian for posting the schematic/pcb and to Stefan's well designed PCB.

Question is though, How did you get this board made up? Its double sided with vias. Has top layer copper pour and seams to be complex enough to be out of most peoples home made PCB capabilities?

How did you guys get this board made up?

Cheers Sid

[IBGold]

Hi Sido,

Save the file to a folder on your desktop you may need to unzip the files with Bit zipper first then open Designspark click open navigate to desktop and to where you put the files click on the files you want to load and click open and they will be there.

6666 have fun with them this board was originaly set up to run the Tinkerer GG Group project which I am still using while waiting for all the details so I can configure the ChipKIT UNO32 version Pete has one of my spare boards but I do not know if he has had a play with it yet there is a problem in the display section but it is an easy fix dependant on what display you use.

Regards, Ian.

[6666]

[ATTACH=CONFIG]23685[/ATTACH][ATTACH]23687[/ATTACH]Sido/6666,

Here is the latest version thanks to Stefan. Open in Designspark.

Regards, Ian.

Thanks Ian opens ok in DS
cheers
6666

[Tinkerer]

Once you open the schematic and PCB files in Designspark, click on BOM and PCB Quote, on the upper right corner. I think it would be interesting and helpful to less skilled designers, if we discuss and comment a bit on the actual parts, the prices etc. while using actual supplier's information.

Tinkerer

[sido]

[ATTACH=CONFIG]23685[/ATTACH][ATTACH]23687[/ATTACH]Sido/6666,

Here is the latest version thanks to Stefan. Open in Designspark.

Regards, Ian.

Hi Ian. I could not open the first attachment 168132. what is it?

Regard's Sid

[sido]

Sid, I haven't done diddly-squat. I'll send you a large stick so that you may beat me.

In my defense, I've had a bit of a change here, we (the royal 'we') decided it's time to move, so off we go! As I write this (8AM Monday morning) I've got to send a rocket up the agent's arse, get the Section 32 back from the solicitor, get the ******** who installed the security glass to come and finish the job before lunchtime, pat the bed, make the cat, etc, and it all has to be done with a broom up my bum so I can sweep the floor when I walk around. I can't wait until 9AM!

Great to see your very first board! Welcome to the club! Now the real heartache fun starts....

mschmahl also picked up a new bit of software and designed a PCB in another project; looks like people are really interested. It's really cool to see!

What happens now is that you get to enjoy the fun and happiness of PCB fabrication!

So what happens is that you check the board every which way from Sunday : you verify every single trace and every component, board size, hole count, everything. THen you get a quote from the fabrication place, and it's great. You're so confident that you order a solder mask option just so the board will look really spiffy. You send off the design. They send you back a reference number. Then :
1) You suddenly discover that the ****wad who made the MCU schematic library left out all the power and/or ground pins; and/or
2) You suddenly realise you've sent off the wrong version of the PCB, and the fab can't be stopped; and/or
3) You suddenly find out that the MCU manufacturer only makes a BGA version of your core component now.

Oh, the fun never stops.

Seriously, though, it's a great achievement to get anything out of an intimidating bit of software such as EDA. Kudos to both you and mschmahl...

Now, while I've done nothing on this design myself, I've been trying to work on the "you know what" (begins with Q and ends with sadness), and I've almost finished the coil board on the other UNIPI or UPIM. So basically, I've done everything except work on this project.

I apologise for my lack of focus.

To help manage my guilt, if there's anything I can do to help with any PCB questions or anything, fire away. I know far less than most people here, but I'm happy enough to answer, possibly correctly.

-PtB

No worries there Pete....You keep up the good work with the X file detector .
Thanks for the Kudos. Just happens, i have decided to learn some form of PCB fabrication now, after many years of neglect or lack of thinking in the right direction......basically was thinking.....(that i cannot do that, out of my league so to speak) hehehehehe.

There are so many Forumites willing to help here and that is what it's all about. You have jumped in the lower end to start with and may seem WTFarout......so many things to learn as you go....So you are forgiven.....by me that is...

I totally appreciate the people on this forum who have the expertise in certain fields....and this is what brings us all as one, combined and a uniform interest.
I totally appreciate the PCB designer's also now as i can confirm it is a time consuming practise.

It just happens where some posted text seams to be taken out of proportsion, but the longer you are active on this great Forum, the more you will understand the inner workings. This metal detecting game is FRUSTRATING.

I think that Metal Detecting design/products is a very demanding aspect in the Electronics Industry and clearly shows that in the Corporate World that there is only a handfull giving it a go in this line of buisiness as a viable venture to date.

Chhers Sid

[sido]

[ATTACH=CONFIG]23685[/ATTACH][ATTACH]23687[/ATTACH]Sido/6666,

Here is the latest version thanks to Stefan. Open in Designspark.

Regards, Ian.

Hi Ian, thankyou for the files.......Managed to open them with D.S after some headaches.

All good now and will see what i am missing in the library with this schematic and add the new profiles for the components i did not have.

Once again much appreciated and hopefully i could work with this until i get the right format as i learn the program extensively.

Cheers For now and thanks.

Sid

[IBGold]

PI_DSPIC304011_A.zipSido/6666,

Here is the latest version thanks to Stefan. Open in Designspark.

Regards, Ian.