Open Metal Detector Project Charter

[Davor]

... provided you are a company or a corporation.
But not an individual inventor.

[Qiaozhi]

Patents are easy to break, and only give you the right to sue someone. Therefore for many ideas, they are a waste of time and money. I have to agree with Don Lancaster, who says to tuck ideas away in
the public domain, where they can be used by anyone, including you.

There are other things to consider, such as relief on corporation tax if your product is patented -> https://www.gov.uk/guidance/corporat...the-patent-box
Although this will be going away sometime next year in its present form, and the new model will link tax breaks to the location where the R&D is carried out. This is to stop 'creative accounting' by some large companies.

Patents can also increase the value of your company, especially if another company wants to buy you.

It depends what you need the patent for. If you just want it as protection for your IP, then you probably need to think hard before spending the money.

[scrungy_doolittle]

Yes. You are supposed to list all prior art, and it

It being the patent, not the prior art.

can't include the exact idea that was already posted by someone else, as it is supposed to describe some original idea. Some people fail to list all prior art, and risk losing their patent - regardless of being granted.
When contemplating a patent, you must realise that it is only good as a litigation tool. If ever it comes to defend your right to produce whatever it is you do, and you do it based on your copyrighted material, there is no patent in the world, except maybe in Australia, that will ever win over your pre-dating solution.
If you still have any doubts, just visit https://www.patexia.com/ and see what sort of research they do
If anyone finds a source that describes a patent and pre-dates its precedence date, such patent is kaputt, out of order, not working, broken, good for nothing, defunct, and also finished off.

The only function of a patent nowadays is that it easily impresses simple people.

Patents are easy to break, and only give you the right to sue someone. Therefore for many ideas, they are a waste of time and money. I have to agree with Don Lancaster, who says to tuck ideas away in
the public domain, where they can be used by anyone, including you.

[Orbit]

You seem to have problems for what people have said elsewhere; you should go elsewhere to file your grievances with them, not here. And if you're tired of what people are saying, then stop reading what they post. Folks are free to share what they want to share, and if they decide not to follow through on prior claims then that's their decision; incessant badgering is uncalled for.

Absolutely support this !

[Carl-NC]

Carl, I call it as I see it. If my asking Woody who claims to have the answer to the best detector
is being too deep I am sorry. I get tired of people saying they have the "best" detector ever made. Then nothing ever happens with it. I guess I am one who does not believe in being politically correct and speak my mind. How many times have you said someones idea will never work? Again I am sorry for speaking the truth.

As far as Woody goes he has said he has the answer. Several years ago he said and even formed a link to post the great results. But that was 5 years ago and nothing else was posted. Left many wondering what happened. Not a peep from Woody about the site.

You seem to have problems for what people have said elsewhere; you should go elsewhere to file your grievances with them, not here. And if you're tired of what people are saying, then stop reading what they post. Folks are free to share what they want to share, and if they decide not to follow through on prior claims then that's their decision; incessant badgering is uncalled for.

[Carl-NC]

My preference of copyright is in terms of being a precedence instrument in case of litigation, and in a case you do have a copyrighted idea pre-dating any patent attempt - nothing can stop you from continuing production. It is true that when an idea flies in the public, even though it is automatically copyrighted, there is no stopping its further development and you can't sue anyone but the blatant copiers. But you are free to do with it whatever you want.
Provided of course it is originally yours.

Gotcha. You are correct.

[BILLY]

Carl, I call it as I see it. If my asking Woody who claims to have the answer to the best detector
is being too deep I am sorry. I get tired of people saying they have the "best" detector ever made. Then nothing ever happens with it. I guess I am one who does not believe in being politically correct and speak my mind. How many times have you said someones idea will never work? Again I am sorry for speaking the truth.

As far as Woody goes he has said he has the answer. Several years ago he said and even formed a link to post the great results. But that was 5 years ago and nothing else was posted. Left many wondering what happened. Not a peep from Woody about the site.

[WM6]

Interesting things about the "1-year grace period" and other limitations for patent application:

http://www.uspto.gov/web/offices/pac/mpep/s2133.html

***
Conditions for patentability; novelty and loss of right to patent.

A person shall be entitled to a patent unless -


(b) the invention was patented or described in a printed publication in this or a foreign country or in public use or on sale in this country, more than one year prior to the date of application for patent in the United States.

***

Mean, that 1-year (or less old) fresh prior art ideas has no implication to patentability first patent filling.
Something like legal heaven for patent trolls.

[Davor]

Yes. You are supposed to list all prior art, and it can't include the exact idea that was already posted by someone else, as it is supposed to describe some original idea. Some people fail to list all prior art, and risk losing their patent - regardless of being granted.
When contemplating a patent, you must realise that it is only good as a litigation tool. If ever it comes to defend your right to produce whatever it is you do, and you do it based on your copyrighted material, there is no patent in the world, except maybe in Australia, that will ever win over your pre-dating solution.
If you still have any doubts, just visit https://www.patexia.com/ and see what sort of research they do
If anyone finds a source that describes a patent and pre-dates its precedence date, such patent is kaputt, out of order, not working, broken, good for nothing, defunct, and also finished off.

The only function of a patent nowadays is that it easily impresses simple people.

[WM6]

Davor, is this still true in nowadays USA "first-to-file" patenting system?

[Davor]

My preference of copyright is in terms of being a precedence instrument in case of litigation, and in a case you do have a copyrighted idea pre-dating any patent attempt - nothing can stop you from continuing production. It is true that when an idea flies in the public, even though it is automatically copyrighted, there is no stopping its further development and you can't sue anyone but the blatant copiers. But you are free to do with it whatever you want.
Provided of course it is originally yours.

[Carl-NC]

I view patents as a legitimate way to protect an invention, but the process is now broken and being horribly abused. Copyrights do nothing for this purpose.

The only reason the gold detector market is going gangbusters (and not so much the last 2 years) is the price of gold. If gold fell to $500 the detector market would fall with it. And almost all of that market is in developing countries, not Australia or the US.

It seems simple that someone would come up with a competitive PI design, but so far no one has, either in corporate-land or homebrew-land. The companies who tried the hardest were Garrett and White's, but those efforts fell short. Why? I can only speak for White's since I was involved with them, and it was entirely a lack of manpower. All of the engineering staff was focused on bread-and-butter hobby detectors (the ones we knew would pay the utility bills) and PI was relegated to a spare-time project. Don't know about Garrett, but their bread-and-butter was security detectors, at least until the AT-Pro.

Several homebrewers have taken a stab at better-cheaper but nothing ever seems to emerge but boasting. In some cases they spent way too much time on public forums deriding the market leader for what purpose I can't fathom, even to the point of being slapped down with a lawsuit. In most cases there were delusions of grandeur of a single person being able to design, build, and market a world-class detector. Somewhere on these very forums are my 7 suggestions for success (or maybe 10, I don't remember), maybe it's time for a review.

Finally, this website commits itself to the dissemination and discussion of metal detector technology; nothing more, nothing less. Most people seem to be more interested in PI, probably because it's easier to homebrew, and a less mature technology.

- Carl

P.S. -- "Billy:" continued provocation will earn you a permanent reprieve from this forum.

[BILLY]

http://detectormods.com/forum/index.php?topic=12.0

[BILLY]

Detectormods where is that detector you were about to release several years ago?

[Thomas]

WM6, thanks much, very interesting! never heard of it before.

Davor, I'll gather up the info and post it.