Can this instrument be used for TH

[nelson]

Hi friends

I will like to ask if anyone knows if the device show on the below link, is good to be used has an earth resistivity meter for treasure hunting.

In advance many thanks

Nelson

http://www.ebay.com/itm/DY4300-2-3-4-Wire-Digital-Earth-Resistance-Earth-Resistivity-Tester-Brand-NEW-/251086567248?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3a75ecf750

[ivconic]

With proper use and full understanding OF COURSE it can be used in soil survey.
By proper understanding i mean to say that resistivity measurements of soil are very complex series of tasks.
Before anybody decide to switch on such survey techniques; i suggest first to read splendid book: " Seeing Beneath the Soil" by Anthony Clark.
Of course there are also other educative books and articles too.
Personally; i made few EPE resmeters and started to learn to work with them. Not exactly what i imagined before. Not that simple and easy.
But if performed on proper way: such methods can give very good results.

[Qiaozhi]

Before anybody decide to switch on such survey techniques; i suggest first to read splendid book: " Seeing Beneath the Soil" by Anthony Clark.

I've just ordered a used copy from Amazon for £0.01 (+£2.80 delivery). Unfortunately it's not the latest edition, but what do you expect for 1p?

[ivconic]

I've just ordered a used copy from Amazon for £0.01 (+£2.80 delivery). Unfortunately it's not the latest edition, but what do you expect for 1p?

I downloaded it from internet.
Very educational.


"...what do you expect for 1p..."
It is worth much more than that, you'll see.
I am having .pdf copy for several months. Very often i read some parts again and again.
It became sort of "Holly Bible" for me.
(Same as some rare articles from G.Payne on other subjects)

[Qiaozhi]

I downloaded it from internet.
Very educational.


"...what do you expect for 1p..."
It is worth much more than that, you'll see.
I am having .pdf copy for several months. Very often i read some parts again and again.
It became sort of "Holly Bible" for me.
(Same as some rare articles from G.Payne on other subjects)

Apart from the obvious aspects involving illegal downloading of copyrighted material, I often find it preferable to have a "real" physical book to study.

[ivconic]

Apart from the obvious aspects involving illegal downloading of copyrighted material, I often find it preferable to have a "real" physical book to study.

Look; i am not that "criminal" at all.
I would be glad to buy book if i could. But i couldn't, there is no way to find it here on local market. Nor in local libraries.
As for ordering from abroad... i think we already discussed that in the past, tough and complicated task.
So, if .pdf document is available on the internet; why not having it?
...
I agree; "real" physical book is always better, easier to read and follow... that's why i printed whole .pdf on paper already!
So, at the end, as you see; i "payed" for it much more than you will!!!

[nelson]

Hi Ivconic.
First of all is nice to share some words with you after long time.

Ok ok, yes this equipment look interesting to me and i will like to do some tryies after i fault to build Every Day Practical Electronics project.

If i m remember rigth, you made one of this units, but never read the end of the story about your project.
NOw i can see that even if you have the machine working , you must follow a logn larning curve. Indeed, i think that data that comes from the machime that i m asking, must place on an excel sheet or a software that can process the grids you are working on. Very similar to Arc Geo Logger equipment

Anyway i will evaluate this and will take a decision to buy it oer not very soon.

Best regards and keep going on good projects my friend.

Nelson

With proper use and full understanding OF COURSE it can be used in soil survey.
By proper understanding i mean to say that resistivity measurements of soil are very complex series of tasks.
Before anybody decide to switch on such survey techniques; i suggest first to read splendid book: " Seeing Beneath the Soil" by Anthony Clark.
Of course there are also other educative books and articles too.
Personally; i made few EPE resmeters and started to learn to work with them. Not exactly what i imagined before. Not that simple and easy.
But if performed on proper way: such methods can give very good results.

[ivconic]

Hi Ivconic.
First of all is nice to share some words with you after long time.

Ok ok, yes this equipment look interesting to me and i will like to do some tryies after i fault to build Every Day Practical Electronics project.

If i m remember rigth, you made one of this units, but never read the end of the story about your project.
NOw i can see that even if you have the machine working , you must follow a logn larning curve. Indeed, i think that data that comes from the machime that i m asking, must place on an excel sheet or a software that can process the grids you are working on. Very similar to Arc Geo Logger equipment

Anyway i will evaluate this and will take a decision to buy it oer not very soon.

Best regards and keep going on good projects my friend.

Nelson

Hello Nelson,
glad to see you here.

Learning curve is not long, everything is pretty straightforward. But erm surveying method is complex and need indeed very good understanding.
Don't give up and don't be afraid of it.
Once you understand the grid and it's rules: everything else is piece of cake.
Same grid "habits" you can use later when working with magnetometer.
EPE rm is easy to build and i don't understand how is possible that you failed to make it??
Best thing about it is cose latest Snuffler software has full support for it!!!
I tried it and it is working like a charm!
In case you need spreadsheet - Snuffler will do too!
Give me more details and let me help you to find and overcome problems you had here.
What was the problem?
Explain?

[nelson]

Hi Ivconic and many thanks for your support has always you do with guys here in the forum.
Well my EPE project was finish, but something was wrong with the numbers you got on the lcd screen. These were not stable and sometimes were not the same after turning the unit off and then on.
All in all, i will apreciate your help about this project, but first let me take the time to try again this circuit to get better information about what is happening with it. I think that a youtube video can be more helpfull to show you what is my problem, cause my english everytime in getting worst.
Last time i used this device, many doubs caame to my mind, for example may be i have a bad ground, or may be i have mede some mistakes when i conected some wires.

Ok, about the device that is for sale on ebay, i think is not to overpriced, so please let me know if you think it can work like an accumeter or at least vere close to it, cause accumeter is very expensi, but has Carl said before, to much money for something that has not to much electronics on it.
Mmmm this post is not about Fisher CZ20 that i have, but anyway i will ask you about my probkem that i have. My detector after a beach hunting by just megerged the coil into the salt water it was working 100%. THen i worked on dry sand almost 2 more hours and everything worked just fine until next day, when i turned the CZ20 on and justa a small noise comes from the speaker like taca taca taca . My imoresion was like a dead batery, so i replace bateries but othing happends. I also made some test supplying correct voltage to the detector with ATTEN APS3005S power supply and nothing. THen i took the decision to cut the coil wire from the base of the detector housing. I measure the induction and the resistance and evrything again looks fine . I resolded evrything and by now the probem looks the same.
So after all those test i think problem in may be on some voltage regulator.
Any comments about this will be apreciated too.

Well Ivconic thanks for your time my friend and have a good week
Regards
Nelson

Hello Nelson,
glad to see you here.

Learning curve is not long, everything is pretty straightforward. But erm surveying method is complex and need indeed very good understanding.
Don't give up and don't be afraid of it.
Once you understand the grid and it's rules: everything else is piece of cake.
Same grid "habits" you can use later when working with magnetometer.
EPE rm is easy to build and i don't understand how is possible that you failed to make it??
Best thing about it is cose latest Snuffler software has full support for it!!!
I tried it and it is working like a charm!
In case you need spreadsheet - Snuffler will do too!
Give me more details and let me help you to find and overcome problems you had here.
What was the problem?
Explain?

[satdaveuk]

Won this for a penny on ebay 2 months ago , played in the garden with it, my mrs and daughter were rolling about with laughter at me.

Regards

[ivconic]

Hi Ivconic and many thanks for your support has always you do with guys here in the forum.
Well my EPE project was finish, but something was wrong with the numbers you got on the lcd screen. These were not stable and sometimes were not the same after turning the unit off and then on.
All in all, i will apreciate your help about this project, but first let me take the time to try again this circuit to get better information about what is happening with it. I think that a youtube video can be more helpfull to show you what is my problem, cause my english everytime in getting worst.
Last time i used this device, many doubs caame to my mind, for example may be i have a bad ground, or may be i have mede some mistakes when i conected some wires.

Ok, about the device that is for sale on ebay, i think is not to overpriced, so please let me know if you think it can work like an accumeter or at least vere close to it, cause accumeter is very expensi, but has Carl said before, to much money for something that has not to much electronics on it.
Mmmm this post is not about Fisher CZ20 that i have, but anyway i will ask you about my probkem that i have. My detector after a beach hunting by just megerged the coil into the salt water it was working 100%. THen i worked on dry sand almost 2 more hours and everything worked just fine until next day, when i turned the CZ20 on and justa a small noise comes from the speaker like taca taca taca . My imoresion was like a dead batery, so i replace bateries but othing happends. I also made some test supplying correct voltage to the detector with ATTEN APS3005S power supply and nothing. THen i took the decision to cut the coil wire from the base of the detector housing. I measure the induction and the resistance and evrything again looks fine . I resolded evrything and by now the probem looks the same.
So after all those test i think problem in may be on some voltage regulator.
Any comments about this will be apreciated too.

Well Ivconic thanks for your time my friend and have a good week
Regards
Nelson

Listen; the way you explain it - reminds me on problems that i had with my first epe erm.
Make sure that your pcb is correct and without mistakes.
I redraw pcb from EPE article in to Sprint but than i made mistake and omit few traces.
For example i omit trace from pin 12 of TL074 (minus) and later when i turned it ON it starts to act similar to what you explained here.
Numbers were randomly "flow" on the screen and device didn't worked.
Next thing to pay attention on it is quartz; must be 3.686Mhz and not 3.2768 as noted in article.
Next and most imoprtant! PIC must be ONLY PIC16F876-04 and NOT PIC16F876/SP or /ISP !!! Remember this!!
I don't know why is that, but i wasted 2 /SP pieces for nothing.
When programmed and put in ERM it is "working" similar as you described too.
I tried to discover why and i searched through many datasheet, but couldn't find exact reason why other versions would not work there!!???
So those can be a problems to your erm. First of all make sure your PIC is -04 and not /SP!
.......

Fisher... maybe the fault is not directly related to fact that you dipped it into water previous day.
Fisher' like Fisher's! Those are having their weak spots. Usually those are MPSU51 at audio and second LM339. It simply happens that those die for no reason.
I had several such cases so far on service.
Before you decide to open it and do a real service; make sure batteries are alright, conections on them also, potentiometers and switches are ok...etc... all mechanical movable and "connectable" parts to be alright. If all those are alright - than it is because of some dead component inside.
First check power supply stage and it outputs. You have schematic of it, i believe, if not than 1265/66 schematic will do you the same.
If those are ok than don't wait but replace LM339.
Let me know what are you discovered and done.
Cheers!

P.S.
Oh cheeesse! I just saw that you are talking about CZ20 and i gave you hints related to 1280!!!
I don't know if those are same or similar, but first check that and than use my hints on it.
I think those are, if not the same, than must be very similar, at least in those stages that we are interested in here.

[ivconic]

Won this for a penny on ebay 2 months ago , played in the garden with it, my mrs and daughter were rolling about with laughter at me.

Regards

I wonder if they will laugh one day when you dig out huge pot full with gold coins!! Ha!
"Who is laughing now!!!"
...
Even that simplified erm can be useful and do the very same job as top ones.
You have to learn how to set up the grid. You have to obey exact grid's rows and columns.
And finally you have to "logg" data ...i guess manually on paper.
Be patience and persistent. Always keep exactly the same distance between "working" probes.
Common setup for "our" kind of surveying is "Twin probe" setup.
I warmly suggest it to you. Put 2 "referent" probes away from grid, some 5-6 meters and leave those there. Move "working" probes through grid, cell by cell, row by row. Each sample (measurement) will need 3-4 seconds with probes in soil and than write down measured values. Remove to next row....etc..etc...etc.. Than next column. And next...etc..etc..
Let the step between measuring points in row be 0.5 meter. For a start.
So actually you will have grid with 0.5x0.5m cells.
Organize such grid on paper, print that paper, than use it on the field to write down your samples (measurements).
That's pretty skim explanation of how to properly work with erm.
Remember: "TWIN PROBE" setup is nice for a start. Later when you gain certain exepriences you can study other kinds of setups too.
That instrument you have there is quite alright although is analouge and simple.
Cheers!

[nelson]

Hi Ivconic.
Very good information you gave me. I will look forward for those errors you discover on this circuit of EPE.

About CZ20, i agree with you to check the circuit beganning from the power supply.
Voltage supply was correct and problem persist.
I m also trying to find out the schematic for this detector, but until now it has been imposible.

I will tell you more when i get some extra news and for shure i will replace the pic of my ERM, cause i have the one you said is not working. I hope i can find the correct version in my country and if not i will have to order one from overseas.

Many thanks and have a nice day

Nelson

Listen; the way you explain it - reminds me on problems that i had with my first epe erm.
Make sure that your pcb is correct and without mistakes.
I redraw pcb from EPE article in to Sprint but than i made mistake and omit few traces.
For example i omit trace from pin 12 of TL074 (minus) and later when i turned it ON it starts to act similar to what you explained here.
Numbers were randomly "flow" on the screen and device didn't worked.
Next thing to pay attention on it is quartz; must be 3.686Mhz and not 3.2768 as noted in article.
Next and most imoprtant! PIC must be ONLY PIC16F876-04 and NOT PIC16F876/SP or /ISP !!! Remember this!!
I don't know why is that, but i wasted 2 /SP pieces for nothing.
When programmed and put in ERM it is "working" similar as you described too.
I tried to discover why and i searched through many datasheet, but couldn't find exact reason why other versions would not work there!!???
So those can be a problems to your erm. First of all make sure your PIC is -04 and not /SP!
.......

Fisher... maybe the fault is not directly related to fact that you dipped it into water previous day.
Fisher' like Fisher's! Those are having their weak spots. Usually those are MPSU51 at audio and second LM339. It simply happens that those die for no reason.
I had several such cases so far on service.
Before you decide to open it and do a real service; make sure batteries are alright, conections on them also, potentiometers and switches are ok...etc... all mechanical movable and "connectable" parts to be alright. If all those are alright - than it is because of some dead component inside.
First check power supply stage and it outputs. You have schematic of it, i believe, if not than 1265/66 schematic will do you the same.
If those are ok than don't wait but replace LM339.
Let me know what are you discovered and done.
Cheers!

P.S.
Oh cheeesse! I just saw that you are talking about CZ20 and i gave you hints related to 1280!!!
I don't know if those are same or similar, but first check that and than use my hints on it.
I think those are, if not the same, than must be very similar, at least in those stages that we are interested in here.

[nelson]

Ivconic
So this meter with just 3 pole conections can also work?

I thougth that you need 4 pole conections, one par has a reference and the other two for tacking surveys.

Anyway i think that the unit from Chine will perform good to, cause it has 100 memories to store data.

Regards


Nelson

Won this for a penny on ebay 2 months ago , played in the garden with it, my mrs and daughter were rolling about with laughter at me.

Regards

[ivconic]

...
I will tell you more when i get some extra news and for shure i will replace the pic of my ERM, cause i have the one you said is not working. I hope i can find the correct version in my country and if not i will have to order one from overseas....

I guess we located the problem! So, you not used -04 version there!? Than everything is clear!
Go for it!
Cheers!

P.S.
I really don't understand why SP version is not working in this project? I analyzed PIC code several times. Nothing to suspect in there. Also datasheet is giving me no clues about this issue!? To make sure i haven't been so "lucky" and bought broken one: i tried with 2 SP chips so far and i got same mailfunction!?
So third time i bought -04 version and everything is working just right.