Analysis this schematic

[Tepco]

As georgi say, problem in timing part. I checked PCB, no visible errors, but recheck for accidental shorts etc. U3 “misfire” this first short pulse due to some reason. Try to isolate problem this way: pulses should look like on gregori's schematic, but 4538 have two complementary outputs, pins 6 \7 and 9\10, measure output, you will see identical signal, just inverted,if just one is wrong, trace that connection or replace chip. But before all this: RECHECK ALL UNUSED PINS,1,4,12,15 TO -10.6V, 3,13 TO GND. If left open, can mess up whole circuit operation. If this is OK, try to probe each MMV, what is on input (5,11) and what you get at output pins to isolate wrong one. Never mind WIMA, company, MKT is just type, fine if value is correct.

[mohandes]

ok
thanks but my pcb and all teransistor and all conection are true.
just i should say to you i dont use WIMA cap(1UF)and i use MKP cap(certain of in my picture of my pcb)

or maybe the oscope destroyed and have mistake in this ferquency? next time i use digital oscope

again thanks

[georgi.g.zhelev]

georgi i check all and Q6 and Q7 are correct, but how test the second 4053
thanks

Problem is here ! SEE shematics.

[mohandes]

I don't have Proteus, not checked PCB. Check if pulses are present on U3 pin6, if not, some error may be in 4538 timing part. If this is OK, and you have no pulse on 4053 pin 11, check transistor, PCB, two 10K resistor values, eventually 4053 (remove it and check pin 11)

Check if pulses are present on U3 pin6
i think it is ok
look at this this is pin6 4053


If this is OK, and you have no pulse on 4053 pin 11.
nearly pin6 is ok(i think) BUT you Careful whether with 4053 and without 4053, look at this (like gnd wave), so i check teransistor,pcb and resistor are ok i am confused.




ok finally i test again all parts and measure all waves by digital oscope(60MHZ)5 day latter,

thanks and regards

[Tepco]

I don't have Proteus, not checked PCB. Check if pulses are present on U3 pin6, if not, some error may be in 4538 timing part. If this is OK, and you have no pulse on 4053 pin 11, check transistor, PCB, two 10K resistor values, eventually 4053 (remove it and check pin 11)

[mohandes]

HI dear Tepco
Check all voltages first, using multimeter, to see if you have -12V, -10V, -10.6V, -7V, +8V from that point, then check if all voltages are distributed properly on PCB.
Yes it is ok , look at this : http://upload7.ir/images/03179233125567751266.jpg and my value(-12,-10.66,-11.06,-7.34,8.1)

Then connect scope probe GND to this point (detector battery powered, or PSU floated from scope GND) and re-check all points, pin3\555, C of BC337, C of BD140, waveform have to be regular square wave of 10V or so.
LOOK at #92 & #91 ,please ,pic of BD and BC337.


In post #95 it looks good, only scope GND may be wrong
i take GND in http://upload7.ir/images/03179233125567751266.jpg

Same way,pins 11, 10, 6, of U4 (4053) must have square wave pulses present, this time +8\-7V.
Ok #96 read it, i check last night my pcb and Q6,Q7 were ok but when i measure by multi pin6 near 8v,pin10 near -0.55an pin11 near-0.6, BUT wave of pin10,pin6 approximately ok Except pin11 that like GND wave.

and i should sure to Removal error or 4053 next i consideration other pcbs
are you download my pb design and check it??

thanks and regards

[Tepco]

and please talk to me simple language because my english is bad.

thanks man

Not possible, I don’t know what simple English is, just trying to write something understandable, English is not my native language either (as anyone can notice).


Problem that may confuse you in this design (typical for all delta pulse variations) is ground reference point. Ground reference, point to connect oscilloscope probe Gnd, or multimeter, GND as marked on schematic, is actually battery + voltage, regulated by LM2940 to 12V so everything is referenced to that point.


Check all voltages first, using multimeter, to see if you have -12V, -10V, -10.6V, -7V, +8V from that point, then check if all voltages are distributed properly on PCB.


Then connect scope probe GND to this point (detector battery powered, or PSU floated from scope GND) and re-check all points, pin3\555, C of BC337, C of BD140, waveform have to be regular square wave of 10V or so.


Next, pin 6 of 5534 is most important point. In post #95 it looks good, only scope GND may be wrong. At this point, you will see some small change if some metal is placed near the coil, DC voltage about 0V, scope set to DC. Same way, pins 11, 10, 6, of U4 (4053) must have square wave pulses present, this time +8\-7V. Seems to be OK from previous posts Next is to check TP 1, 2 5, for slowly varying voltage of around 0V in presence of metal (set RV7,8,9, to minimum, GND)


Rest of circuit is questionable, this is bit too complex for first project, not sure it is all correct. Even original delta is bit complicated, some experience using simple design like Surf or Barracuda can help. Too many things to go wrong with this.


Forget maps and all, this is more about schematics, can be even more complicated. No need to post too many waveforms, just describe problem.

[mohandes]

georgi i check all and Q6 and Q7 are correct, but how test the second 4053
thanks

[BigBang]

mohandes.. you and your avatar is very idiotic!!


I see my country TURKEY within the borders of your country, What are you trying to imply that..???

It looks Ottoman's Imp. Borders ...

[lonelyWOLF]

mohandes.. you and your avatar is very idiotic!!


I see my country TURKEY within the borders of your country, What are you trying to imply that..???

[mohandes]

this picture for source irf740
and this link for drain it:
http://megaup.ir/images/eq_video-201...1-18-04-51.zip .......ОК!!

NЕ 5534 ......PIN 6.....foto 4...........................................OK!!

hi dear georgi
first i Thank you for your help and your Patient.
ergo finally pin6 ne 5534 and irf 740 correct(how can measure it,it is 600v!?)

finally problems :
why pin11 4053 like waveform GND and not 10v?
and why pin6 4053 dose not exactly 10 volt and waveform?
(under picture)




i think because pin6 ne5534 have a good wave so pin3 ne5534 is good too.?ok!

thank you and if possible guide me to repair finall problems about 4053,
thanks

[georgi.g.zhelev]

and i Waiting to anyone to help me.
In summary i think the first problem in the pin3 n35534 because just 555 set in pcb and all ics out of the pin headers and it have bad wave, when i repair that i solve my first problem.
another problems in pin 11 4053 and pin6 4053.
waveform pin11 4053 like gnd ??????

i think pin6 ne5534 and drain or irf is correct(have 600 volt)
and another of pcb is ok

thanks and regards and excuse for my english


ok i put my pcb design and very picture in my pcb to your help for me.
thanks and regards

this picture for source irf740
and this link for drain it:
http://megaup.ir/images/eq_video-201...1-18-04-51.zip .......ОК!!

NЕ 5534 ......PIN 6.....foto 4...........................................OK!!

[mohandes]

and i Waiting to anyone to help me.
In summary i think the first problem in the pin3 n35534 because just 555 set in pcb and all ics out of the pin headers and it have bad wave, when i repair that i solve my first problem.
another problems in pin 11 4053 and pin6 4053.
waveform pin11 4053 like gnd ??????

i think pin6 ne5534 and drain or irf is correct(have 600 volt)
and another of pcb is ok

thanks and regards and excuse for my english


ok i put my pcb design and very picture in my pcb to your help for me.
thanks and regards

[mohandes]

and for 4053:
5. U2 4538.......Q5 colector..... Sa ...10v/ 50 mks... OK! YES IT IS OK AND HAVE 10 volt 50-60mks

6. Q6 colector ........ Sc .......10v/50mks.....OK! IT IS NOT exactly correct have 8v and the waveforms (should have two 50mks)but the first wave is not good but second correct

7. Q7 colector ............................Sb ........10v/50mks ....OK! IT IS VERY BAD ,this wave like ground wave(i put this picture)
this picture for wave ground and pin11 4053.and other picture for my coil.

[mohandes]

ok this picture for pin6 ne 5534(just you should know all of time the search coil was connect)
you can see the ripple,why?
and I think my problem in input of ne5534(pin3) how can i repair that?