Tesoro Eldorado

[FOMA]

change by red colour

[FOMA]

Here is so beside I well work.

[nakky]

Hi Ivconic, Sorry, change your pcb a little,not checked yet.Grt Nakky.

[nakky]

Hi Ivconic,we were busy at the same time with the ELDORADO.Grt Nakky.

[Max]

maybe there's an erro on schematics

So you are saying my pcb has no mistakes? Right?
Thank you very much Nakky! You saved me waiting day or two and recheck myself again...
Best regards!

P.S.
Wirements are simplier than on TGS. Draw on schematic pretty logically.
Maybe there is mistake? I rechecked those several times, yesterday.
I obeyed schematic completely. Still confused?

Hi,
this configuration is similar to BandidoII's one: look picture below.

You the 47K resistor instead of 220K and there's no capacitor of 10nF there... but the rest is about the same stuff.

BUT look carefully... you'll see a permanent connection of all-metal channel to output part that is missed in that eldorado schematic...

I think the 47K resistor was connected different way... from output of all-metal channel to the output amplifier (instead of the 200K of bandidoII version) and capacitor is missed in eldorado... maybe to have faster response... then could be in the two ways below.

First is how I think it was... second (mod2) is how you can test too... to make it similar to bandidoII ...just lower the 47K to 1K there.

Try the first mod and let me know how it works.

Best regards,
Max

[Max]

Yup, i performed detailed checks yesterday. All Metal mode doesnt work. When i switch to it detector dies at once. Again nothing burn,warmed or hot.
I noticed also that Disc and Geb pots doesnt make any difference in Disc mode? Threshold and Sense and Gaind works, makes differences in sound and sensitivity. I unsoldered every suspectable component and measure it, one by one. All accurate!? I would rather expect md not to work at all in Dsic mode but not in All Metal mode???In my case it is oposite???
It is detecting in Disc mode but does not disriminate at all...
It is not detecting in All Metal mode and does not produce sound?
When switched ON and works in Disc mode, when switched to All Mode it literally act as it was switched Off??? I checked and checked....sheesh!
Nothing yet. My eyes get very used on present situation on schematic and wirements draw, so if is there any mistake, right now i am not able to spot it.
I will need day or two to rest my mind and than to take another "fresh" look on it. Maybe than i will see where is mistake.
I am sure in one thing; either i made mistake in pcb, either schematic is not accurate? About components i dont have any doubts any more.
Yes Max again you are right, i am using TGS coil.Logically it must work here. Oscillator is the same,RX is almost the same, frequencies at Eld. and GS are pretty close. No reason why shouldnt work, and why coils wouldnt be exchageable.Ok small differences i can accept, but not this.
Another thing, when it detects in Disc mode that Cu plate, sound is a bit "wider" than at TGS but still it is not nonmotion sound, looks more on motion sound yet? You know what i mean? Instead "teeeeeeeeeeet" i got "teeet"?
Very confusing situation.
I think even with these TL072 it must work so so in all modes.Not great but must work. So main reason seems is not cose i put TL072 instead LF442.
I never doubted at W.Lahr's traces. All of those turns to be very accurate so far. Again great tribute to W.Lahr. But when i do agains checks on my pcb, and if no mistakes, i would start to suspect that must be some unintentionall mistake there, on schematic. Or maybe other guy, one who posted it made intentionall mistake??? Who knows? I dont..
Regards!

Hi,
I've made a mistake...sorry!


Kind regards,
Max

[nakky]

If we don't make the same mistake,pcb is right.

[ivconic]

Thanks Ostin. I will change it later afternoon and see differences.

[ivconic]

So you are saying my pcb has no mistakes? Right?
Thank you very much Nakky! You saved me waiting day or two and recheck myself again...
Best regards!

P.S.
Wirements are simplier than on TGS. Draw on schematic pretty logically.
Maybe there is mistake? I rechecked those several times, yesterday.
I obeyed schematic completely. Still confused?

[OSTIN]

there are no mistakes at pcb, i have just checked too. Maybe is better use resistors 5k1 near 12 pin 4024

[nakky]

Hi Ivconic,I checked pcb with schematic but not the wirements.I don"t no how the wirements must be,that is always a problem for me.Grt Nakky

[ivconic]

Yup, i performed detailed checks yesterday. All Metal mode doesnt work. When i switch to it detector dies at once. Again nothing burn,warmed or hot.
I noticed also that Disc and Geb pots doesnt make any difference in Disc mode? Threshold and Sense and Gaind works, makes differences in sound and sensitivity. I unsoldered every suspectable component and measure it, one by one. All accurate!? I would rather expect md not to work at all in Dsic mode but not in All Metal mode???In my case it is oposite???
It is detecting in Disc mode but does not disriminate at all...
It is not detecting in All Metal mode and does not produce sound?
When switched ON and works in Disc mode, when switched to All Mode it literally act as it was switched Off??? I checked and checked....sheesh!
Nothing yet. My eyes get very used on present situation on schematic and wirements draw, so if is there any mistake, right now i am not able to spot it.
I will need day or two to rest my mind and than to take another "fresh" look on it. Maybe than i will see where is mistake.
I am sure in one thing; either i made mistake in pcb, either schematic is not accurate? About components i dont have any doubts any more.
Yes Max again you are right, i am using TGS coil.Logically it must work here. Oscillator is the same,RX is almost the same, frequencies at Eld. and GS are pretty close. No reason why shouldnt work, and why coils wouldnt be exchageable.Ok small differences i can accept, but not this.
Another thing, when it detects in Disc mode that Cu plate, sound is a bit "wider" than at TGS but still it is not nonmotion sound, looks more on motion sound yet? You know what i mean? Instead "teeeeeeeeeeet" i got "teeet"?
Very confusing situation.
I think even with these TL072 it must work so so in all modes.Not great but must work. So main reason seems is not cose i put TL072 instead LF442.
I never doubted at W.Lahr's traces. All of those turns to be very accurate so far. Again great tribute to W.Lahr. But when i do agains checks on my pcb, and if no mistakes, i would start to suspect that must be some unintentionall mistake there, on schematic. Or maybe other guy, one who posted it made intentionall mistake??? Who knows? I dont..
Regards!

[Max]

Friends,friends! What could i do without you!?

Damn accu.!!! It is brand new, just bought it! Never checked it!
Voltage is 10.15V not 12V!?
Right now is hooked up on charger and it is charging.
I used another one and tested Eldorado with it;
it is working, yes....but working bad. Frequency is 11khz. Voltages are now 7.9V and -6.00 volts. Does not drop when detection occurs.
Current drain is 42mA without sound and 60mA with sound at full detection.
Right now it can detect Cu plate 10x10 at 15-20cm distance...bad, not good.
But also it works only in Disc mode, in all metal mode device is dead!? Not reacing at all.
I rejected that 100pF from 8. pin of LM308, earlier added as trying to be smart a.s.s.! No need for it, LM works pretty good at that place without any external compensation.
Right now i cant pull right conclusions since LF442 are replaced with TL072. Until buy proper opamps...
But still something is not right.
I still have doubts about my wirements. Need to check that again.
Nakky you said you checked schematic, did you checked my pcb or just schematic?
If you checked my pcb and there is no mistake than must be in wirements or it is possible that i put some bad component there....or schematic is not accurate? Dont know what to think?
Also that negative voltage worrrys me. At Tesoro Golden Sabre, same setup gives me -6.30 Volts and here only -6.00 volts.
OK must be cose of those TL072..
Leto i did exactly what you suggested me; i changed 0.47 to 0.22, 0.047 to 0.022 and RX to 0.015 and frequency rised as expected.
Same detection...no progress..
But for now i will keep these changed capacitors. I like more idea to work on higher frequency.
OK...i am returning to check all over again.
I'll inform you if any news.

Thank you all!
Regards!

Hi,
if you want more current (so more voltage out) from converter try lower the resistors at base of the two transistors... as I wrote before.

You can lower to 1k5 or also 1K if needed... you'll get them saturate more easy and so some bit efficiency more there... but expect also more noise on supply rail... BTW the actual value for them is good BUT for original components there... not your stuff... TL072 and the like I mean.

About depth I think if you use the TGS coils you need some extra care on front-end... first op. amp. and, more important, disc section tuning with right components values I think could be something wrong about values there... better checking with scope at sampling pulses if you get so bad detection of copper with it. Try also swap the RX coil leads.

Current drawn seems good for it.

Best regards,
Max

[ivconic]

Friends,friends! What could i do without you!?

Damn accu.!!! It is brand new, just bought it! Never checked it!
Voltage is 10.15V not 12V!?
Right now is hooked up on charger and it is charging.
I used another one and tested Eldorado with it;
it is working, yes....but working bad. Frequency is 11khz. Voltages are now 7.9V and -6.00 volts. Does not drop when detection occurs.
Current drain is 42mA without sound and 60mA with sound at full detection.
Right now it can detect Cu plate 10x10 at 15-20cm distance...bad, not good.
But also it works only in Disc mode, in all metal mode device is dead!? Not reacing at all.
I rejected that 100pF from 8. pin of LM308, earlier added as trying to be smart a.s.s.! No need for it, LM works pretty good at that place without any external compensation.
Right now i cant pull right conclusions since LF442 are replaced with TL072. Until buy proper opamps...
But still something is not right.
I still have doubts about my wirements. Need to check that again.
Nakky you said you checked schematic, did you checked my pcb or just schematic?
If you checked my pcb and there is no mistake than must be in wirements or it is possible that i put some bad component there....or schematic is not accurate? Dont know what to think?
Also that negative voltage worrrys me. At Tesoro Golden Sabre, same setup gives me -6.30 Volts and here only -6.00 volts.
OK must be cose of those TL072..
Leto i did exactly what you suggested me; i changed 0.47 to 0.22, 0.047 to 0.022 and RX to 0.015 and frequency rised as expected.
Same detection...no progress..
But for now i will keep these changed capacitors. I like more idea to work on higher frequency.
OK...i am returning to check all over again.
I'll inform you if any news.

Thank you all!
Regards!

[nakky]

Hi Ivconic ,I have check schematic but can"t find mistake.Grt Nakky.