Ivconic Tries to Be a Smart A.rse

[gurdal]

Hello, master ivconic.
If I had even 20% of your experience in developing detectors, I might have been able to help you.
I must admit that I learned a lot from you.
The circuit I want most is a deep-seeking, motion-free IB metal detector circuit.
Thank you very much for considering such a project. I wish you success in your work.
Gürdal

[ivconic]

My "... experience in developing detectors..." is no better than yours.
What I have too much is experience with various models, technologies and years on the real sites.
However, in the last couple of years, developing my magnetometers, I collaterally learned a lot about DSP and today I may (emphasis on "may") be able to finally design a good VLF-I/B.
But before we jump into something so uncertain; let's first analyze well how much smarter people worked, long before us.
Why did I find that the GTI2500 is actually so good and didn't realize it before?
I forgot to mention that I have an "imaging" coil with my GTI2500.
The word "imaging" itself doesn't mean much, if anything; it's pretty pointless.
But what is hidden behind that data?
Morphology of that "imaging" coil! Bingo! It is a concentric-coplanar coil that has 1 TX coil and 2 RX coils! Bingo!
The VDI cursor at the top of the screen is truly unmistakable... JUST FOR THAT REASON!
A quick parallel/analogy with one of the most advanced models today; Manticore!
What distinguishes this model and its top performance?
Special coil that also has 2x RX coils too!
Of course, according to the explanations from the ML kitchen, it is for completely different reasons.
Are these enough clues?
The reason why I, as a hobbyist, will never succeed in making a good enough non motion VLF-I/B detector lies precisely in that "detail"!
Without sounding pretentious, I think today I am finally able to design a very advanced VLF-I/B detector.
But I am totally unable to make such a coil! Let's face the truth, let's not lie to ourselves, it's the harsh truth.
Only the "big" ones can do such an undertaking. And we "small" can only hope that the "big" will hear us and finally satisfy our wishes.

[Skippy]

Your unfired round has fallen from an aeroplane, probably WWII vintage, the casing may have a manufacture date-code, in addition to place of manufacture.
I have similarly found one, in woodland, pointy-end down ( and hence firing pin area on the top, waiting for my digger ... ). Luckily, I pinpointed it well, and dug around it cleanly, the only surprise being the size of it when I pulled it out the soil.
It's worth checking the painted colour on the bullet tip. They are frequently black = armour-piercing; or silver = armour-piercing incendiary. The first has a hard steel core [check with a magnet], inside a brass outer, the second is the same, but with a gram or so of high-explosives added.
AP's are safe, but probably illegal to own; API's are dangerous, and definitely illegal to own. I suggest disposing of it in a responsible way.

[Olly]

Looks like a round from a Browning 0.50 heavy machine gun to me.

[Qiaozhi]

Hindsight is a wonderful thing. But most importantly you learned a valuable lesson.
Time to rest and let the wounds heal.
I'll eventually get to the missing smileys.

[ivconic]

Your unfired round has fallen from an aeroplane, probably WWII vintage, the casing may have a manufacture date-code, in addition to place of manufacture.
I have similarly found one, in woodland, pointy-end down ( and hence firing pin area on the top, waiting for my digger ... ). Luckily, I pinpointed it well, and dug around it cleanly, the only surprise being the size of it when I pulled it out the soil.
It's worth checking the painted colour on the bullet tip. They are frequently black = armour-piercing; or silver = armour-piercing incendiary. The first has a hard steel core [check with a magnet], inside a brass outer, the second is the same, but with a gram or so of high-explosives added.
AP's are safe, but probably illegal to own; API's are dangerous, and definitely illegal to own. I suggest disposing of it in a responsible way.

That is very good information, I have to admit I had no idea about it.
It is very likely that the bullet fell from an aircraft and very likely dates from II World War.
The first cursory wipe of the top of the grain showed a "silver" color! Ouch!
I will check the details, it is certain that it will end up somewhere hidden in nature under a pile of rocks, I have no better idea.
This time I won't make hasty decisions and now it's too late to report to the authorities...
Enough problems since yesterday!
Yesterday was a "crazy" day.
While I was in my torment; my wife's cousin died, suddenly, a young woman, today I spent the whole day on the road, we went to another place for the funeral, stood all day in the sun, now we came back, all broken and tired.
What to say?
There are days like that... there are periods like that.
George is right; it's time for peace and rest. Time for a handbrake!
...
Update: I didn't want to wait for tomorrow, the bullet was put away forever in a very safe place where it would never be a problem again.

[ivconic]

Looks like a round from a Browning 0.50 heavy machine gun to me.

That drew me to look online at the entire history of that weapon.
I have just become very well informed and from now on such nonsense will not happen again.
But as I watched the materials on Youtube; it's fascinating to what degree of evil human inventiveness can go!
What would happen if all that intelligence and knowledge were used for positive, good and humane goals?!
That evil is already about 100 years old! And it's still in use! (they did not find a more effective means!)
We're getting a little off topic.. but yes, it's that machine gun that mighty Rambo takes down from the helicopter and carries in his hands and kills 49876 enemies with one burst in one scene!
Coincidentally, the other day I saw a short clip, Sylvester Stallone, now a very old man, gives a short statement that in the meantime he realized how great evil war was, he experienced enlightenment and now he thinks differently!
Yes, ok, that's right, in the meantime he earned hundreds of millions of dollars on those stupid things, thereby unknowingly popularizing those situations.
Who knows how many generations grew up on that madness.
Maybe that's why we live in this world today?
I was in the war, but I was a paramedic. Not to kill but to save.
It is enough to scratch a finger on your hand and realize the reality.
What can be said about the people who suffer today en masse much more intense suffering?
I didn't want to touch on other topics.
But it is obvious that this kind of "finding" is an unavoidable part of our hobby.
It is good to exchange knowledge and experiences first hand.
Today we know much more than yesterday.
If this topic will help any newbie and spare him the trauma; then this topic has fulfilled its function.
Good people, colleagues, thanks for the information!
Although I am 60 years old, I have learned a lot from yesterday to today.
I think that a forum like this should have a section that deals with these topics.
Because we hobbyists are on the "front line" and at high risk of accidents.
That is why people should be informed as much as possible.

[surf-tech]

Well said, Mr. ivconic!
Times change, but one thing that hasn’t lost its value is everything you’ve contributed over the past 20 years. Your legacy on this forum is truly unmatched, and you have helped and taught so many people along the way.
Thank you for all these years of sharing your knowledge, experience, and passion with us, both within the hobby and beyond it. Your efforts have made a real difference, and that’s something no bad day in the field can ever take away

[EL NINO]

...Ivconik...take it this way, that on that day you had a Luck from Hell../or we say /..that you were only injured by a match from a cartridge...it could have turned out much worse... I am a believer - Catholic.. and I believe that you definitely have some protection up there and someone from "The HEAVEN" is holding a protective hand over you, and that you still have a few more aces for such and similar adventures...
At least you have a lesson now...how not to do it again....I certainly wish you a speedy recovery from this injury.. .friend,..

I typed the ammunition for 12.7mm American or Russian cartridge, or even 13mm German anti-tank cartridge..

[ivconic]

Thanks for the compliments surf-tech, thanks EL NINO.
I am honored by such an opinion, but I think it is overstated.
Because 20 years on the forum was a long journey with a lot of give and take, in the end that is the main value of the forum and that is why we are still here.
I got more from the forum than the forum got from me, that's the truth and the right measure.
My sometimes unnecessarily long posts and frequent off-topic jumps are just proof of how much this forum means to me.
But I know from experience that sometimes you have to overdo something - in order to provoke people's reactions, to provoke them to write something and learn something new from it.
Activities on the forum are noticeably stagnant, and that's why often an off-topic topic comes in handy to "shake up" the dullness and to start some activity.
It is difficult to focus only on the topic of metal detectors today. Because it is very difficult to come up with a new idea.
The more I research the old articles, patents and works of many people before us; I realize more and more how smart some generations before us were! It's fascinating!
They left a very large and insurmountable legacy. That is why it is very difficult to come up with something new today.
Here is an example I come back to that I mentioned before; Garrett GTI2500. I had the first one in 2001. When it was a hit and very expensive.
Back then I worked exclusively in "Zero" disc mode. Hoping for the best. I wasn't too thrilled. And I sold the first model very quickly. Over the years I had 2-3 more and soon resold them.
It took 25 years for me to "discover" how to properly use AM mode and only then to discover how advanced and cleverly designed this machine is!
Smarter people would need a few weeks to a few months, it took me 25 years! Oooahahahahahahaha!
Those new experiences awakened in me the desire to examine it a little better.
Maybe my thesis about the advantage of a search head with two RX coils as the main advantage is wrong. But it seems to me that it is not wrong.
The more I think about it - the more it seems to me that it is a very good idea, which at first glance does not seem so important.
Each of the two RX coils goes into a separate RX front end, based on the OP37. Even today, a very usable and high-quality opamp.
Focus on such an approach and extraction of the AM non motion mode as the basic operating mode of the detector; maybe it would create a new quality, maybe some new good project?
It would be good to find a complete and accurate schematic of the GTI2500. I haven't succeeded so far.
A bunch of hardware on the original GTI2500 could easily be replaced today with a single ESP32-P4 with the addition of an external ADC chip with at least 4 channels. That would make the whole device much easier to carry.
But the problem of making such a coil still remains. Maybe this will be my new topic to think about during the coming winter.
It is extremely difficult (for me) to balance a concentric coplanar coil.
That's why it seems easier for me to opt for the ML Manticore approach, where the TX coil is symmetrically placed between two identical RX coils. Balancing seems easier to me in that case, or maybe I'm wrong?
The two RX coils will be in counter phase, but that is easily solved later in the RX frontend stages and maybe even easier in the DSP.
We'll see... whenever I think of DIY some coil; I lose the will to continue working! Ha, ha, ha!
However, I happen to have 2 of the same coils for the GTI2500, that might make my job easier in experimentation. We'll see, winter is upon us.

[Aziz]

You got lucky there, Ivica. Hope you feel better soon and take more care next time.
Aziz

[ivconic]

You got lucky there, Ivica. Hope you feel better soon and take more care next time.
Aziz

Oh Aziz, thank you!
But it's just a minor finger injury.
It is not pleasant, the wounds are deep, on the middle finger they go to the bone.
But hey, it's just a finger!
Here in Serbia, it is common to say: "A leaf fell on a bear! (and hurt it "horribly")"! Ha, ha, ha!
It's no problem.
For a couple of weeks I will be picking at the nose with the fingers of my right hand! That's the only shame in the whole story!
However, what could really happen is much more serious!
During the detonation, the slug which flew up suddenly; it could easily fly sideways and hit me in the head, eye... in that case you wouldn't be reading this post today!
The idea of the topic is to show human stupidity (mine) and the unfathomable consequences that can come from it!
I think that this topic has fulfilled its role, one should not play with those evil relics of the past.
...
But in the same topic, your review of my last post and thesis of 2 RX coils in one search head would mean much more to me now!
I want to hear your opinion.
...
Originally, in Garrett, the 2 RX coils were intended for the role of more accurate estimation of the depth and size of the object.
However, obviously, very accurate "cursor" discrimination was obtained as a collateral benefit.
And that's a field for further research, in my opinion.

[ivconic]

The only really wrong thing I wrote was the mention of Manticore!
I was specifically referring to the "DDD" coil for GPZ and ZVT technology.
And at Manticore they used a visual marketing trick!
The coil for Manticore is only "DD" but the design insinuates that there is "DDD" inside!
I am correcting this mistake of mine so that there is no confusion in further considerations!

[moodz]

Write your name on the bullet and carry it with you. Then from now on you will be immune from future mishaps ... because the bullet with your name on it is in your pocket.

[ivconic]

I assume, dear sir, that you are, among other things, a top expert on LRL? (unfortunately George still hasn't fixed the smiley I need here)
Ah Paul!
If I would listen to you; I should be wearing a necklace with 80kg of shells around my neck!
At this age it would be quite a challenge for me...
Paul, whenever I think of you; I was overcome with great optimism and enthusiasm and of course a good and healthy laugh!
What I'm going to write now is hilarious, but it can also be misunderstood!
But whoever understands this in the right way will understand the essence of life and the recipe for surviving difficult moments!
Yesterday at the funeral of my wife's younger sister, when a huge group of people stood silently in grief and pain... my internal and quite unconscious mechanism for self-survival suddenly started working and while the priest sang the dirge and recited the eulogy... I had only one image in my eyes and head!
One has to have special genes to understand this situation.
I think Serbs are the only "race" on the planet that has these genes strongly expressed.
The closest to Serbs, I noticed, are Australians!
So now I risk severe negative odium when I post this!
Paul, I'm sure you'll get this right!
Use online subtitles, if it doesn't work, let me know so I can explain!
(George! I miss the hilarious smiley face!!!)

In the video, I'm the one talking and my wife is the one slapping me behind the ear!