TESORO GOLDEN SABRE

[simonbaker]

Hi,
actual recipe is with 0.25mm at both tx and rx coils. you could use 0.30mm for tx with no pain, if needed.

On rx side wire is not so critical... you could use e.g. 0.27 or 0.28mm there too, and even more like 0.30mm if needed or you have just it.

The important is matching tx frequency and get a good non-resonant tuning for rx side, with phase required (around 200°) between tx and rx signals.

Kind regards,
Max

What is meant by "non-resonant"? There is capacitor C6, which should be resonant with RX coil at about 16.3 Khz. Do you mean coil by itself should not self-resonate at 16 Khz?

[simonbaker]

Ha,ha,ha,ha,ha,ha!!! You have more crazy ideas than me! Ha,ha,ha!!

Ok...call me crazy, but i will do that for you. Just give me some time, i cant do that right now...

You're the best, take your time

(if too much trouble don't worry)

[Max]

Thanks Amtech,Ivconic and Max
but Max:
you know Litz wire is better than single core wires. Because of low skin effect in high frequency. Say me if i'm wrong?

Another question:
Plain or concentrated coil?
What is your suggestion?
I guess plain coil has lower capacitive effect.

Hi,
litz have important use in e.g. am radios... cause of that skin effect that make worse the Q of receiving coils made with monowire...

But in MDs is quite different: you have capacitance between wires to consider and have to match perfectly tx frequency for maximum parformance: that , you know, is possible with litz but usually problematic at few KHz range cause litz for AM is made of really thin stuff and you get large inductances with fewer turns than with enamelled copper wire.

So, it's possible using it, but you'll sure lose any reference e.g. about number of turns and need to find yourself.

"Concentrated" coils are the ones... the other way some manifacturer used for PI (e.g. in sandshark there's something like this... ) but they aren't good for VLF stuff... aren't effective cause you need large inductances of many mH and so need tight wounded turns.

Kind regards,
Max

[Max]

Is thicker wire like .30mm better for the TX coil, or is .25mm fine for both coils? We see different advice sometimes.

Hi,
actual recipe is with 0.25mm at both tx and rx coils. you could use 0.30mm for tx with no pain, if needed.

On rx side wire is not so critical... you could use e.g. 0.27 or 0.28mm there too, and even more like 0.30mm if needed or you have just it.

The important is matching tx frequency and get a good non-resonant tuning for rx side, with phase required (around 200°) between tx and rx signals.

Kind regards,
Max

[amtech2005]

TESORO GOLDEN SABRE

Wild_Desert , You can use Litz wire , but you need to use a smaller diameter or gauge of Litz . If Max said use 30 gauge of regular enamel , then use 33 gauge of litz . Yes , Litz is better !!!!! But your windings must be very precision windings on your forms. Minelab Commander series of search coils use Litz wire !!!!!!! Try to first wind the Lits wire to the DC resistance values on this chart. Then check your frequency of oscillation , if it is close to Golden Sabre 1265 light frequency . Then check your inductance , you will notice a difference from normal enamel wire !!!! And you will detect deeper than all of us using our cheap copper enamel.....Litz is much better wire , more expensive too , and $50. dollars for 500 feet .......Please let us know your results !!!!....See the chart I reposted again............Eugene

[ivconic]

Hi Ivconic -

If you get a chance, is it possible to make a TGSL PCB like this:

- Remove R48 - R51

- Make just tiny bit more compact so the PCB circuit fits inside a standard Compact Disk size (inside the circle). It almost fits now.

Maybe crazy idea, but I'd like to see if I can print directly on copper clad by putting PCB in Compact Disk tray of inkjet printer.

Ha,ha,ha,ha,ha,ha!!! You have more crazy ideas than me! Ha,ha,ha!!

Ok...call me crazy, but i will do that for you. Just give me some time, i cant do that right now...

[simonbaker]

"..Thanks! That helps not waste money.R48, R49, R50, R51 - remove from circuit, they don't do anything?.."

Actually they dont..

Hi Ivconic -

If you get a chance, is it possible to make a TGSL PCB like this:

- Remove R48 - R51

- Make just tiny bit more compact so the PCB circuit fits inside a standard Compact Disk size (inside the circle). It almost fits now.

Maybe crazy idea, but I'd like to see if I can print directly on copper clad by putting PCB in Compact Disk tray of inkjet printer.

[wild_desert]

Thanks Amtech,Ivconic and Max
but Max:
you know Litz wire is better than single core wires. Because of low skin effect in high frequency. Say me if i'm wrong?

Another question:
Plain or concentrated coil?
What is your suggestion?
I guess plain coil has lower capacitive effect.

[simonbaker]

Hi,
I'm not sure your litz will be suitable there. If can't find enamelled copper wire there (I'll wonder if so... but could happen too) you can recover from some transformer or dc motor, dismantling it.

You need 30AWG wire: 0.25mm bare copper, with varnish around 0.27-0.28mm.

you can try with litz but results are undefined... as I know nobody made coils that way and litz is sometimes employed as shielding material...

You can also find the wire in old TV sets... and similar stuff... just recovering it. You could also use 0.30mm (bare wire) enamelled copper, if needed.

Kind regards,
Max

Is thicker wire like .30mm better for the TX coil, or is .25mm fine for both coils? We see different advice sometimes.

[Fred]

Hi Ivconic,

You know how i like to hunt for jumpers, so here it is
regards,
Fred.

[Max]

Hi to All

I'm new in this excellent forum ...
I'm trying to make TGSL-1265 with newer ICs and my own pcb.
In my country(IRAN) there is no shoping place for search coils.
I have Litz wire same as AM radio's antenna bobbin.
I want to make an 8" DD search coil for TGSL but i can't find a last/best design.
I need yours experiences ...
Best regards

Hi,
I'm not sure your litz will be suitable there. If can't find enamelled copper wire there (I'll wonder if so... but could happen too) you can recover from some transformer or dc motor, dismantling it.

You need 30AWG wire: 0.25mm bare copper, with varnish around 0.27-0.28mm.

you can try with litz but results are undefined... as I know nobody made coils that way and litz is sometimes employed as shielding material...

You can also find the wire in old TV sets... and similar stuff... just recovering it. You could also use 0.30mm (bare wire) enamelled copper, if needed.

Kind regards,
Max

[ivconic]

I had chance to see and test Vaquero 2 Germany only for 20 minutes
It would be nice if somebody have schematic of RX frontend and TX part, to post here.. I hadn't time to open it and trace those.

[ivconic]

"..Thanks! That helps not waste money.R48, R49, R50, R51 - remove from circuit, they don't do anything?.."

Actually they dont..

[ivconic]

Hi to All

I'm new in this excellent forum ...
I'm trying to make TGSL-1265 with newer ICs and my own pcb.
In my country(IRAN) there is no shoping place for search coils.
I have Litz wire same as AM radio's antenna bobbin.
I want to make an 8" DD search coil for TGSL but i can't find a last/best design.
I need yours experiences ...
Best regards

Go for it. Your own pcb means it will be only TGSL (without 1265 in name).
Do that and please inform us about results.
Regards!

[amtech2005]

TESORO GOLDEN SABRE

IVCONIC , Remember almost all of the circuits we modify or repair or Clone on this Forum are "Discontinued Models" -no longer coming off the production line !!!!!!!!! Also , Tesoro electronics inc. is one of the last "Great American" Traditions still in business. I respect them , very , very Highly !!!!..........Welcome Wild_desert , for your litz wire , Please use 33 gauge awg. , which is close to 0.18 mm , recomended for 12-15 khz. Your other questions should be answered tommorrow.........BYE..........Eugene