RELIC HAWK

[Max]

Hi,
yes I see too...latency....

in S mode it's almost fast enough... in M mode is still OK, unfortunately the L mode doesn't work at now... or, well, is too unstable to check... but I think this is the worse mode in this machine.

But what should I do now ?

That's the real question... cause I've tested about everything about disc and cannot stop that dang iron response from far away! Is the circuit designed for this ?

From simulations and real measures I get same stuff... so I cannot explain why, even if coil is wrong, I get iron ignoring from very near and detection from far away ?????????????????????????????????????????????????? ??????

That's unbelivable stuff... that one needs to put near and near the iron to get it ignored. Is the opposite of other detectors!

Fred: what about your PCB , still troubles on components ?

Kind regards,
Max

[eclipse]

dont know about the RH but musketeer has excellent recovery speed,
and the discrimination pattern is all the same near or far from the coil
it's not 100% accurate but at least is the same no matter the distance
from the coil. (you might experience slow rec speed, since the CS has this problem too

[Max]

The coinseeker also does this, in air its seems to ingore it
but on the field, if the depth is big everything is GOLD!

Hi,
I see... but if so you must conclude as I do that there's something wrong: now we use different coils and get similar results...at least seems Coinseeker behave this way on soil... where my stuff even on the bench... so I think there must be something wrong in schematics or , at least, in components.

I don't belive original RH has such kind of problems... impossible to me.

What do you think about ?

Kind regards,
Max

[eclipse]

Hi,

Till now no more mistakes found there... nothing just it simply refuse to reject iron at deep!

Kind regards,
Max

The coinseeker also does this, in air its seems to ingore it
but on the field, if the depth is big everything is GOLD!

[Max]

Hi,
Max,Ivica how are you?

Hi,
I'm here... my RH clonation stalled a bit... I have also other stuff to do ATM. The troubles are still on disc... I'm also a bit annoyed of it cause everything else seems work but iron is still detected from far in disc mode... and if not corrected this behaviour is a real crap.

Till now no more mistakes found there... nothing just it simply refuse to reject iron at deep!

Kind regards,
Max

[tiktak]

Hi,

Hi,
Max,Ivica how are you?

[ivconic]

Indeed!

[Max]

I knew that before, only was affraid Max could think that now i am fooling arround. Yes...this time those are diodes not transistors (life is strange, i never thought i would say this!)...
No, seriously...Max if you look more carefully on RH too, you will see those 2 there also. But second look on latest photo .... seems one is diode for sure and other could be transistor!? 3 routes...or i saw wrong?
Anyway, on previous RH schematic (faked one) those 2 diodes are present in audio stage. Reversed actually, protection...limitter...the hell with Minelab's mumbo-jumbo designs!
I remember for sure that those are dides on RH. When my RH burned, i tried to locate problem and checked all componnets in audio part. Beleive me or not i desoldered those two and checked with multimeter - diodes for sure!
But i am not sure in Musketeer case...could be transistors?
Anyhow...i think Minelab solved well, the problem i've been talking about at TGS thread - parasitic ballast at output. At TGS some instabillity and ocassionall mum chatters appears due poor audio output design. On Minelab RH same thing never appeared.And audio at original RH is sweet and very pleasant. Very soft and clear "bleep" when detection occurs.
Could it be the reason of using small transformer and all those filtering with diodes, 1uF capacitor and resistors? I think it could be.
Cose we have same "machine" at Coinseeker but much worse audio...unlike original RH. Coinseeker's audio looks more like on TGS. Escpecially if you pull out 2 of those 3 4148 at 4024 and remove 2 transients...i did that and got almost same tone as on Musketter but not that soft and pleasant.
So...my idea is to take idea from RH or Musketeer and apply on TGSL...only not sure how!?
Regards!

Hi,
ok... they are diodes this time ... but the question is ... how the hell Musketeer drives the speaker directly if the stuff is the same that at RH ?

Really confusing stuff...

Kind regards,
Max

[Max]

Hi Max,
Yes you are right about the other schematic, strange indeed .
But reset input at 2.5V above reference cannot be very good .
will continue working on my PCB, will post pic soon
Problem is that i am making 2 projects at same time.
Regards,
Fred.

Hi Fred,
it was at GND... so a bout 5V from -Vee, that could be good enough if +Vcc is high enough.

That's why it worked also with pin2 at gnd, but then, device stops working at 10.75V that way.

Kind regards,
Max

[Max]

Max,
I think you may find that under 10.75 V, the oscillator no longer works (at least simulations indicate this).

Regards,
J. L. King

Hi,
no... I've tested on my PCB it stays up and running still at 6.5V only.

Kind regards,
Max

[eclipse]

Coinseeker detection signal sounds really ideotic, specially on the field.
I wounder why would minelab place such a big and heavy transformer instead of normal small inductor?

[ivconic]

Max,

This time, those are diodes. BAS16 to be exact (see attached PDF data sheet). SOT23 case. The key is the "A6" marking. If you look at all the other pictures, youll see that they are used all over the Musketeer board (in fact everywhere there is a general purpose diode).

Regards,
J. L. King

I knew that before, only was affraid Max could think that now i am fooling arround. Yes...this time those are diodes not transistors (life is strange, i never thought i would say this!)...
No, seriously...Max if you look more carefully on RH too, you will see those 2 there also. But second look on latest photo .... seems one is diode for sure and other could be transistor!? 3 routes...or i saw wrong?
Anyway, on previous RH schematic (faked one) those 2 diodes are present in audio stage. Reversed actually, protection...limitter...the hell with Minelab's mumbo-jumbo designs!
I remember for sure that those are dides on RH. When my RH burned, i tried to locate problem and checked all componnets in audio part. Beleive me or not i desoldered those two and checked with multimeter - diodes for sure!
But i am not sure in Musketeer case...could be transistors?
Anyhow...i think Minelab solved well, the problem i've been talking about at TGS thread - parasitic ballast at output. At TGS some instabillity and ocassionall mum chatters appears due poor audio output design. On Minelab RH same thing never appeared.And audio at original RH is sweet and very pleasant. Very soft and clear "bleep" when detection occurs.
Could it be the reason of using small transformer and all those filtering with diodes, 1uF capacitor and resistors? I think it could be.
Cose we have same "machine" at Coinseeker but much worse audio...unlike original RH. Coinseeker's audio looks more like on TGS. Escpecially if you pull out 2 of those 3 4148 at 4024 and remove 2 transients...i did that and got almost same tone as on Musketter but not that soft and pleasant.
So...my idea is to take idea from RH or Musketeer and apply on TGSL...only not sure how!?
Regards!

[KingJL]

If you don't change that... the 4024 will simply stop working at 10.75V along with the rest of circuit ...gates...etc and you'll never be alerted of e.g. battery drop or why it suddenly die that way!

Max,
I think you may find that under 10.75 V, the oscillator no longer works (at least simulations indicate this).

Regards,
J. L. King

[KingJL]

they are different at audio stage: there are 2 SMD transistors in Musketeer that there aren't in RH. The 2 transistors are probably some push-pull stage but I'm not sure about...

You can see them here... difficault to follow cause tracks are partially covered by components.

Max,
This time, those are diodes. BAS16 to be exact (see attached PDF data sheet). SOT23 case. The key is the "A6" marking. If you look at all the other pictures, youll see that they are used all over the Musketeer board (in fact everywhere there is a general purpose diode).

Regards,
J. L. King

[Fred]

Hi Max,
Yes you are right about the other schematic, strange indeed .
But reset input at 2.5V above reference cannot be very good .
will continue working on my PCB, will post pic soon
Problem is that i am making 2 projects at same time.
Regards,
Fred.