Jeohunter - Visual Ground Scanner

[Funfinder]

treasure map!

Simple answer: sometimes history repeats and old battlefields became in worldwar2 "trashfields". btw. K stands for cannonball, you can see the single trees and the shown area is around 80 x 150 meters and that's just around 1/50 of the whole place! I would need 5 times longer with usual coilsize "brute force hacking" such large sites that's why the Jeohunter is simply brilliant!

[WM6]

The really cool advantage of a detector like Jeohunter with almost half meter coil
is that you can search for large iron objects in an area full of iron trash!

But why you bother with Jeohunter for large iron objects, if you can simply go to scrap yards and find what you need?

[Funfinder]

@ Qiaozhi
The technical power of a detector and what you finally find are 2 different things:

And the calculation is not just the price of the MD but also the hard work, what it
costs driving to special sites (I could find much more valuable stuff but at the
moment I'm not motivated visiting 100km or miles distant places) plus hotels
and equipment and beverage and all this things.

I'm not that stupid to tell here in the public the exact amount of worth I found
already with the Jeohunter or with all other MDs too and/or since many years
but I can assure you it pays off!

And not just for me, also concerning the culture-historical aspect for the
people where I'm living. They will get stuff never seen for 200 years and longer...

Besides I like this kind of adventure so much and this is very valuable, too.

Some (crazy?) mountainclimbers invest 50.000 bucks for Mt. Everest and I
doubt at the end those are more happy or satisfied than me.

Shure, this old bucketbottom wasn't the most attractive example but I don't
care if somebody thinks: "Wow, great, trash at 60cm."
I found already a just 7cm cannonball at almost 50cm which is the
end for most usual "mini-coil-detectors". That new find was just another
plain, true and authentic demonstration that you can find deep stuff and
much deeper than this with the Jeohunter at high-mineralic ground.


@ Hi Mechanic,

> smallest coil 8x6
Perhaps, but not much deeper, and only if you make thousands of sweeps...

But be shure of one thing: You never know if it's really trash until you dug it out!

The really cool advantage of a detector like Jeohunter with almost half meter coil
is that you can search for large iron objects in an area full of iron trash!
You can discriminate iron but this won't help ya if you wanna find special
objects out of this metal. A usual MD detects every nail and especially 5cm big
objects give a huge beep but with Jeohunter I can recognise if something
is "just that small size" immediatly even without display.

In that case I'm not scrubbing over the floor but searching from 20cm distance
where only signals I can receive up to 30-40cm above ground are of interrest!
And still I get targets 40-50cm deep! (and deeper if there would be any)

It's beyond compare for those who are searching only with usual coil sizes...
I'm doing this too but only at very steep regions and I know the differences.

[Mechanic]

That alloy was detected as 65% valuable
and not as iron etc. which is impressive at that compressed highmineralic
ground-depth. IB has alot advantages under such circumstances because
compared to PI you almost can go shure it is really metal and not rocks.

G'day Funfinder,

Don't worry mate, If there was a lump of steel the size you have found, at the depth you found, in the not so highly mineralised ground you found it in, I am very confident that I would be able to find that even with my smallest coil 8x6" mono The difference would be I could identify it as trash by the strength of signal and the depth that it is at.

Now with a 1m coil, that would bellow in for sure!
Ps don't tell everyone or they will all want pi detectors

[Qiaozhi]

I guess the $64M question is ... "Have you found anything of value with the Jeohunter?".
It would take a lot of not-rusted bucket bottoms to pay for itself.

[Funfinder]

Induction Balance

The attached pdf explains the principle incl. schematic of sensitive IB.
Took a long time from 1977 until Double D coils became popular...

Page 6 shows the critical adjustment directly at the coil - this explains
the Jeohunters special wooden platine with capacitors etc. there.

Now I'm about 99% shure the Jeohunter uses IB because the Nokta
uses it for shure - it's described at the technical data on the manual
of their newest Golden Gate Detector:

http://www.noktadetectors.com/downloads/Goldengate_Klavuz_En.zip

This is the updated version of Golden King without 1m coil but
with carrying harness and bungee cord for reducing weight.
It's ca. the same price like the usual Jeohunter without 1m coil
had, but I hardly doubt it will go the same deep. The GPS and
"computerisation" may be attractive for some but for real
successful treasure hunting other factors count more.

Back to the IB:
There is no electrostatic foil around the coil windings which makes it
more sensitive but wet grass is a problem - it reduces sens. ca. 20%
because there are alot "inductive signals". The pdf say it detects coke -
that's fine if it's a cold and fresh pepsi max for whisky-cola!

Yesterday I found a notrusted plate @ 57cm (22 inch) depth at a place
where once there was a river. The ground was almost hard as concrete.
At 80% sensitivity - size around 17cm (7inch) diameter and 1mm thin.

If you dig such holes during 1h and the find doesn't appear and doesn't
appear until you get it down very deep you really experience "depth".
This is no more sunday-afternoon walk in the park like with coin-hunting.
But it's much more interresting! I guess the find once was the bottom of
a demolished zinc-waterbucket. That alloy was detected as 65% valuable
and not as iron etc. which is impressive at that compressed highmineralic
ground-depth. IB has alot advantages under such circumstances because
compared to PI you almost can go shure it is really metal and not rocks.

All in all 'til now I've been searching for ca. 50 long search-sessions and
the durability and overall construction quality of the Jeohunter ist good.
It even survives rain or temperature far below zero. And the coil is as
good as new even sometimes I bumped into stones, roots or trees.
All those factors counts if you want to have a serious detector.

[Funfinder]

@WM6

As a compensation for all your unfair mockery and ridiculous insinuation against the
Jeohunter are you man enough to admit finally that you were wrong concerning the
real existing technical abilities of this hitec detector and what you didn't knew or
do you like to go on and on with your unobjective opinion about this good MD?
Or is this your principle: "Throw enough dirt, something will remain sticked!"

[Funfinder]

Very detailed answer, thank you.

As we can see clearly now for very small nuggets other detectors are needed as for very large deep stuff. And especially very small coils for 0.05g ones, too.

About large metal object near coil and coin still detectable:
this is with the coil stationary and waving the coin near the coil

And the "overpricing" is a problem of alot brands. It's no massproduction, it's alot improvement, engineering and development so even if a portable DVD player consists of more electronical parts it's much cheaper compared to such "special devices".

vlf = these MDs are using very low frequency. You can pulse or analyse the radiation
differently but the energy-level remains the same - that's what I wanted to say.

And shure there are much more minelab users who share their experience in forums but there exists also different opinions. The only thing I heard so far concerning gold-fields that there were alot treasure hunters who ordered Noktas or Jeohunters for the african continent last year but I have no info about country, ground condition and nuggets size. That's why I guess the Jeohunter could be really useful searching for gold - but only if the nuggets aren't too small. Through induction balance it can identify smallest changes in mineralisation level so perhaps they use it detecting ore-veins or ground that has promising conditions.

> Jeohunter (...) they are confident that they work as well as claimed.

You are absolutly right, only an "australian gold field test" would show how good it works there and how useful it is. And the user who tests it should have already some experience working with that MD plus searching at those fields.

So at the moment I think your super modified Minelab is best choice especially if it comes to very small nuggets.

I saw that youtube video where the gpx5000 with 12'' (30cm) coil found some 1inch (2,5cm) coin 17'' (40cm) deep and that's a fantastic result. But middle class MDs can find such coins just 10cm (4inch) less deep and only costs 1000 instead of 5000-6000 bucks that's why it always depends how lucrative the sites are where someone searches.


If you have some spare time you can do me a favour by making some Minelab deep tests. You could dig in some can, chest or alu case or try this with different coil sizes in air. How useful are Minelab MDs finding very deep stuff? What are your personal experiences so far?

[Mechanic]

Hi Funfinder,

From what I can tell vlf detectors are a lot more immune to emi because they look for phase shift and amplitude changes to indicate if metal is present near the coil. Pi detectors send out a pulse that induces current into targets. We try to pick up these weak magnetic fields produced from the target as it(eddy currents) decays. A good pi detector has sensitivity in the nV range, thus they are a lot more susceptible to noise. But you must admit that to pick up eddy currents from a 0.05g nugget(if you can call it that!) in mineralised ground is a pretty good effort!

So when you can detect a coin near a huge metal box after it has been reset, do you mean that you can detect it by waving the coil, or with the coil stationary and waving the coin near the coil? If it is the latter ML detectors can do this too, even on small gold nuggets! ML have a self adjusting threshold so if you were to move the coil near a large metal object and sit the coil there the threshold would go back to its normal tone then if you wave another target near the coil that will be heard too.

Not sure what you mean by "PI and minelab uses VLF too" PI is PI, vlf is vlf. Yes ML do make some vlf machines, but not really for use in the goldfields, although some can be used there with limited success.

As for the different ground types, the threshold self adjusts, its just that sometimes this can sound like a real target. Depending on your experience you can discount most of them. Real targets are a lot harder to balance out than ground.

Now with the hotrocks, ML actually use 2 different length pulses to stimulate targets and ground, they use this to cancel the response from most hotrocks and ground and it does work quite well, there are not too many that get through. Hotrocks don't have eddy currents, their response is from magnetic relaxation, during the tx on time these rocks become partially magnetised and then take time to relax back to their original state. By the way most of the ground in our goldfields will stick to a magnet.

Yes I agree that ML units are overpriced, but the same could be said for joehunter! At least with the ML units there is tons of feedback from many users. The same cannot be said for joehunter at this stage. At the end of the day we can talk all we want but the real test is in our goldfields. The ground you work is most likely not anything like the conditions in the australian goldfields. Until I see a joehunter here and can test it and others test it too I will remain sceptical. However if the results were really good, you and everybody else would hear about it. Might be a good way for joehunter to sell some units. Perhaps they should send one over for testing if they are confident that they work as well as claimed.

As for the mods to my machine, it is an sd2000. It has lower noise components in the front end receive, lower resistance and capacitance receive fets. The filtering had been adjusted to let slightly higher frequencies through so small nuggets are heard easier and is much more responsive to bigger ones too. This has also enabled the sweep speed to be faster. The power supply has been replaced with a new very low noise one. Then the main one is the logic cct that used to create the transmit and sample timings has been removed and a board with a micro-controller fitted to do all of the timings. This can be reprogrammed with new timings unlike the original cct. The best that could be done before was changing crystal frequencies, but this had many disadvantages.

[Funfinder]

cheers mechanic!

> At 20cm I would expect to get a strong signal!

Not if you are searching like the way I do.
Sweeping the coil very fast and mostly 10-15cm above the ground.

I know persons who need a half day to search a few sqaremeters and listen to any little signal the detector gives but not me - I have to deal with pretty huge areas.

Best strategy there is "running" smaller or larger circles from 50 to 500m in diameter!
That way you already can get some rough overview which new locations could be promising.

And I could adjust ground balance every time perfect but most of the time I don't care because I get the targets anyway and because of my searchstyle I have alot "out of quiet range beeps" either so I don't care. One little resetbutton pressing directly at the holder and everythings fine again.

I told you about near TV, highvoltage line or coil near large metal.
What I wanted to say is that the detector doesn't get disturbed by all of these factors.
You still can detect a coin if a huge metal box is near the coil and the unit was resetted.

Of course it can't detect through a metal plate and if the ground is very strong mineralized it will weaken the electromagnetical field like brick- or any stones weakens radio waves, too.


> being vlf I suspect that it would not perform any where near as well on targets in ground as compared to air tests.

PI and minelab uses VLF too and mineralized ground weakens it - what matters is strong transmission power with still good "ground eliminating".


> it is the mixture of different ground types that cause me grief.

But this is just a matter how fast your detector could be readjusted.
The Jeohunter with one single reset button press for fast purposes.

And the prob with your maddriving hotrocks is the strong signal they gave compared to much smaller gold nuggets especially because for PI those are principally "metal", too - because those reflect the waves the same like metal.

VLF Induction balance is different - it trys to be "one field" within the mineralized ground or hotrocks - becaming one with this situation. So the hotrock no longer disturbes - it becames invisible. And because the hotrocks eddy current structure is much lower than bright "gold" you can distinguish them.

There is induction field of coil a and coil b. Both are participating from each other and when something comes between those fields a new reset value is needed. The ground has to became part of the whole field even if the ground constist of hotrocks. In that case the coils induction became completly different than in air but those are still in balance so anything crosses the hotrocks that has not the same induction as these rocks you get some unbalance.

If you have an area with scattered hotrocks those need to remain below some trigger level compared to gold-nuggets and if the PI can't create such "ground zone" but still beeps on hotrocks you have a problem. Good groundbalanced the Jeohunter would detect hotrocks as cavity and gold as metal. But the large coil of the Jeohunter only would find bigger nuggets so you would need a Jeohunter with 8 inch coil which doesn't exist until somebody hacks the coil-specifics. Perhaps the Jeoscan would work - it's coil is around 12inch.

please tell me more what mods you made and what do they improve.

I know Minelab builts good detectors (though overpriced, too) and especially developed for very tiny gold. It always depends what you wanna find. btw. in Australia you also can go to beaches into the shallow water and find alot goldrings too like anywhere in the world. If the minelab or your mod makes it really waterproofed.

[Mechanic]

Hi Funfinder,

At 20cm I would expect to get a strong signal! I have dug many a hole over a foot to retrieve an old rusty nail using an 18" coil. I would expect that larger coil would go deeper again.

In my experience clay is not so much a problem, it is the mixture of different ground types that cause me grief. But once ground balanced on a particular ground type, I have full sensitivity and depth and when I search it does not matter if the coil is raised or lowered or even touching the ground. With the different ground types within one swing of the coil, I am able to identify them by changing my sweep direction by 90 degrees and sweeping again. Often a different ground type is in a line. The other method is to adjust the ground balance a bit and if it is balanced out within about 2 turns it will most likely be ground and not a target, especially if the other varying ground in the area balances at this same position.

Now I can't think what the hell I'd be detecting next to the tv! But underneath powerlines is a more likely spot to detect! But if it fails to be useful on mineralised ground then it will be of no use underneath powerlines to me.

Why would you want to position your coil near big metal objects? Or are you saying that it can come close to them without letting the smoke from the inside of your machine? I can place my coil on my car with the detector on and it is fine with that. I have never tried detecting items through water, but I don't think I would have a problem with that either, with the exception of salt water.

I would be interested to see how it would perform on the mineralised ground we have here in australia, but being vlf I suspect that it would not perform any where near as well on targets in ground as compared to air tests. I also think that the false signals because of "hotrocks" and the like would drive a person mad to the point of wrapping it around a tree! I like my detector to be sensitive to the small and large nuggets, that way it is universal. If I were detecting an area that did have large nuggets down deep I would opt for a Minelab and a large coil, 30" would be nice. You should try one over some spots where you have found items with the joehunter, I think you would be surprised. I think I will stick with my highly modified Minelab

Cheers

[Funfinder]

Hi Mechanic,

sometimes I'm searching at sites that were formerly swamp - now dry with alot moist clay "holes" and the Jeohunter works well there.
A few days ago I found a 1x3cm rusty metal piece down 20cm in wet clay which gave a big signal - I guess because of the "rusty-halo".

But clay is heavy mineralized stuff so you need to search slower and with always same coil to ground distance (tolerance ca. plus minus 5cm/2inch @ sensitivity 80% otherwise wrong signal but easy recognisable).

The Nokta uses high sensitive induction balance so I guess the Jeohunter uses it also that would explain why you don't need to move the coil for metal recognition and why it penetrates mineralized soil so powerful:

The ground became one with the coils induction and per reset button became value zero (no sound or display output).
If some metal or cavity "object" crosses the balanced fields while sweeping the coil the difference in impedance and magnetical power gets detectable.

btw. the Jeohunter is completly immune against electro-smog! You can search directly under a 380kV highvoltage-line or 5cm near the TV - you even can position the big coil 20cm near big metal objects - doesn't matter. And some Nokta Golden King test has shown that the find is even detectable below 1m of pure water (perhaps much more - don't know how large the tested object was - the not fully waterproofed coil was above the water-surface).


topic gold-nuggets:
If you have the possibility to search a huge area where are really one big nugget (bonanza) lies directly on the ground every 1000 squaremeters I would recommend you the Jeohunter but not if there are just very tiny and seldom nuggets and some of them 20cm deep. The Jeohunter can find nuggets that have just 3grams but I guess those are already very rare. Saw some guy at youtube who found 3-4cm long and 2cm thick goldnuggets in Australia and if those are scattered over a huge area and not very deep the large Jeohunter medium coil would be perfect for recovering them. But first you have to be very lucky finding out where those fantastic bonanza-sites are located. Otherwise I suggest buying a not so expensive Minelab and check out which locations are really promising!

[Mechanic]

Mr Funfinder,

How does your machine handle ground containing lots of clay(moist) and ironstone that is highly variable ( up to 3 ground types in 1 sweep of the coil?) Oh and I want it to detect gold nuggets, not steel crap. Steel is easy to detect and could probably be found with a K-mart special.

[Funfinder]

Making good detectors bad and ridiculous isn't that funny as it may look -
but it's a good counter-strategy fighting back with the same weapons!

@ Mechanic
If your upper arms incl. muscles have around 8x12cm you should be powerful
enough for the Jeohunter and even without changing hands you need strenght
in both arms.

You can put some bag or rucksack on your back but that's unpractical so
this is the weight in your other hand:

mini-rucksack 400gr
shovel: 750gr
drink: 700-1500gr
snacks etc.: 300gr
reserve battery: 400gr
wrapping materials: 50gr
raincape: 15gr
small digicam or cellphone: 350gr
__________________
Thats around 3,2kg

plus in my case super-solar-cell-ace250pinpointer: 700gr

PLUS findings!!!

After some hours of search those 4kg "empty" weight
becames 8kg even if drink and food is already finished!

This weight just dangles on the other hand so in the beginning it's not heavy
but the more metal you find the more the rucksack is the problem and not the coil!

[Mechanic]

You dont believe, dont you?

Look what happen to my friend after 1 month of Jeohunter use:

Total muscular dystrophy.

PS: he is left handed!

PMSL

I feel sorry for your poor friend, he should have used the other hand as well!