RELIC HAWK

[tiktak]

Hi,

Hi,
Ivconic.
I now that this is not the most important now but can you tell me what size is this coil finaly?I mean coil housing!Outher d=37 or 35cm?On the coil itself must be 35!/the windings/And finished coil 37cm!Right?

[Alexismex]

Hola Ivconic,
Thank you very much for your clear response and sincerity,
First need to resolve accurate schematic from all those versions, we have here.Last one looks more accurate.
I agree with you , lot of headache if schematic i not accurate , if we can have a good schematic, it will be ideal ,and all the hard work will be concentrate in the realization of a good coil for the RHL.I will put all my work to try to help in this project of RH.
I understand also the big difference between coins research and relics ,and to not mix the case.... Here we are must interesting to go for relics or pots of coins... we have found already many coins all this years ... to want now concentrate in finding more "big things" !!! For you it is not the same with these beautifully Greek coins field where sometimes one coin represent a big artistic and monetary value.
Also we know the possibility and lacks of the PI design and for the moment forget to try to discriminate with it... waiting to see the real advance in the devil Nemesis project ???
Have a nice day of projects,
Saludos from Mexico
Alexis

[ivconic]

"...and my doub was if Tejon is one last design from tesoro , I do not switch to Silver sabre to deceive myself...I have the Toltec 100 with original coil also it is same!!!...dn`t go deep..."

Most Tesoros not supposed to go deep. Those are not designed to go deep.
So it is normal.
Those machines are primary imagined and planed as excellent coinshooters.
I am more than satisfied with TGSL as coinshooter. Performs much better than 90% of coinshooters on market today.

RH on other hand, is designed as relic prospecting machine, so logically it goes very deep, no wonder.

Do not be confused here, those are quite different principles. Do not mix them and their performances.

[ivconic]

Max preformulated all questions in one simple and correct question.
I also like to keep things as simple as possible.
Answer is YES, RH is superior over TGS in all points. YES i do beleive, RH with eventual 27cm coil will perform much better than TGS.
RH has more better optimized circuitry,more suitable working frequency for higher depths and more stabille&accurate discrimination.
Main advise would be; yes do make RH instead TGS, you'll get much better performances.
Only....problem so far was i didnt have all correct documentation for RH. TGS turns to be easier to make, fast and cute design, suitable for amateurs like us.
Now, RH "fragments" collected and maybe is time to give a try and make it.
Coil for it would be least problem. First need to resolve accurate schematic from all those versions, we have here.Last one looks more accurate.

[Alexismex]

Hello Max and forum,
"do you think RH has a better electronics and balance, so will shine over TGS using same coil type/dimension" ?
I Agree with you 100% , perfectly ,
If the electronic schematic is better and good for the RHL , I will go ahead, search for the ic's number label??? and made the printed circuit , coil, etc... because here where i live in Mexico many mining soil , and the ground is worse very mineralized , we need vlf like Australian soil....
( I have a good home Pi for iron 100% !!!and very deep ), but now i need a good VLF to go deeper 1 meter or one meter and a half with discrimination for one feet square target...or less
Last week I test the TEJON (Tesoro) with his owner who know it for two years in our field test ...Do not detect target(copper 20X20cm) down deep to 80 cm in this mineralized soil ... and my doub was if Tejon is one last design from tesoro , I do not switch to Silver sabre to deceive myself...I have the Toltec 100 with original coil also it is same!!!...dn`t go deep...

perhaps like Ivconic say I must make a homemade coil for testing good (not tesoro coil because it is standard coil not very "tuned")

Also the same day we test the Minelab 3000 and 3500 for deep search with the big coil , the two react the same(no one better another) and go nicely to 1 meter deep for a 20X20cm copper target...
Thanks for this superb forum
...nobody sure have the time to experiment all the forum ideas ...
Saludos a todos.
Alexis.

[tiktak]

Hi,

Max can you tell me whic IC which is?Please!
On this last schematic.

[tiktak]

Hi,

Hi,
From what I can see the windings should form 35cm circle innner d and 35,5 outher d!Which is cased in 37,5cm coil housing?Which have inner d=33cm?Because I cant find this size I will have to make a coil housing this days,so it can be readey for saling soon.And I am wondering what are the exact dimensions?
Also what is the shape of the overlap area?I remember that you have used minelab shape for this 27cmDDcoil for TGS.So it must be the same?But still think that we miss something there.
Finaly I will see this 37,5 cm coil.I am curies will it be deeper on my ruff terains?

[tiktak]

Hi,

Ivconic,
now when I have read all again one question pupout in my mind!
I use my TGS with very slow moves because of the difficulies provoked buy terain.rocks etc........
So I use it almost like non-motion.Now I am curies what is the differance?
Please tell me you are EXPERT here.
thanks

[tiktak]

Hi,

Hi,
Max.
I am fully agree.
But the probleme is that TGS become unstable and hard to balance with coil over 27 cm!Thats and Ivconics opinion I am shore because I were so interested in bigger coil that have asked several times this quetion.But maybe the differance here is that RH could handle this bigger coil/which buy itself means much more depth/and stay rock stabile!?!??!
We will see

[Max]

Hello Ivconic and the forum,
You know well the RH Ivconic because you use it 3 years .
what is the difference with the GSL for the discrimination and primary for the DEPH research ...
Tell us if it is better to make the GSL or the RHL ....
do not know if you experiment yours coils with the RH ...Tell us we are very interesting ...
If the RHL is the deeper VLF machine because i NEED one ...
Thank you Ivconic
Alexis

Hi Alexis,
sure depth and disc are the most important issues about doing one or the other... also both projects are complex enough and require so much time that one must be really motivated to make one, including coil etc.

Sure , also, about TGS and TGSL we have plenty of informations and people that already made clones... and so who wanna try them will for sure achieve good results and could find help from the forum members who already made.

I think the question you made to Ivconic is meaningful but we have to consider a "little" detail too: coil size

We have TGS/TGSL running with the large DD but not as large like RH's coil is.... if I remember well RH was equipped with something 15'' minelab coil !

15'' means 37.5cm diameter.... WOW very big coil for a VLF, and we have just 27cm DD coil on TGS.

That's the problem: how to compare them this way ? too much difference at coil size to make reliable compare between the two.

Then where the RH probably shine ???
Well , I need Ivconic confirms that cause he has great experience with it, but think RH shine on stability and operation in worse soil conditions.

The unit is an australian product... and that say everything for me... worse soil couldn't be a problem for RH where , probably, TGS will drive you crazy...

Why ??? I think we modded TGS , changed e.g. fixed GEB etc to suit our needs... but RH was thinked from scratch to be rock solid in hell of a ground... with hi-mineral content etc etc it uses 5KHz oscillator... not 14.6Khz and this is another fact to keep in mind when compare...

So... probably the question must be changed in:
"do you think RH has a better electronics and balance, so will shine over TGS using same coil type/dimension" ?

Do you agree ?

Kind regards,
Max

[Alexismex]

Hello Ivconic and the forum,
You know well the RH Ivconic because you use it 3 years .
what is the difference with the GSL for the discrimination and primary for the DEPH research ...
Tell us if it is better to make the GSL or the RHL ....
do not know if you experiment yours coils with the RH ...Tell us we are very interesting ...
If the RHL is the deeper VLF machine because i NEED one ...
Thank you Ivconic
Alexis

[tiktak]

Hi,

Hi,
Ivica.
How are you?
So this is non motino not like TGS?
What is the diferance?

[ivconic]

Hi,
I think a bit interesting stuff is the temp compensated voltage reference: LM336-2.5

It's something that is there to mean "you need a stable voltage here"... and often something that in "common" MD you don't see. Seems that the stability issue is related to stability of that reference over temperature... and that's nice cause one could even find better solutions today, though a bit expensive... but if the purpose is making one clone... I see no problems at all.
Other interesting stuff is related to TX section...

Ivconic you used RH much as far I remember... what do you think of non-motion mode in it ? Is it superb for you or not ?

Kind regards,
Max

Yup! Used it for 3 years almost.
What non-motion mode??
You mean Pinpoint mode? Oh yes. No. I used it almost always in Disc mode.
Real thrill - using RH!
Before RH i had White's Eagle IIc, also excellent detector, but not so powerfull as RH.
Only one which can compete with RH in depth test is White's Eagle serie starting from Spectrum and up to MXT. RH is deeper a bit and have more accurate discrimination, although White's machines are also hell of machines.
I am talking here about highest league of metal detectors, not about medium class, so keep in mind that if you want to pull maximum out of those, you must have pretty rich experience in operating them.
RH actually acts as motion detector unlike mentioned White's models. On White's you can "simulate" motion mode by preseting so many presets there, but in their nature, those are full non motion machines - great advantage over motion detectors, especially in hands of experienced users.
Once you get used on some good non motion detector, i guarantee - you will forget motion detector for ever.
But...good non motion detectors are very expensive...always some catch!
Best i can advice to every interested is some from Eagle serie...plenty of those !
Carl once mentioned some Nautilus. I guess it is also non motion, although not sure.Never had chance to see it in action.
It is funny...but DFX, although great machine, is a bit worse than previous models....or it was just my subjective impression!? Not sure yet...

[tiktak]

Hi,

Hi,
max.
yes,maybe you are right.I am cnfused looking only the schematic.
Can anyone make PCB?According original schema?Max can you see any purpused facked parts?
Thanks

[Max]

Hi,
Max!
How are you?
The S M L is switch wich changes the searching mode S-small ithems;M-medium ithems;L-large ithems.
This is what I now.But more interesting for me is fixed GEB!

Hi,
yes probably is like you said... I confused things... but it's about same stuff reversed: at L device is slower, so can catch deeper and larger targets... and at S is faster so can catch small things at few depth.

Kind regards,
Max