TESORO GOLDEN SABRE

[Delbert grady]

non polarised caps

I do believe it is possible to make the non polarised 4.7 uf out of two 4.7 uf polarised caps. just solder the two negative leads together.

[nakky]

Right

J_P you are right

[J_Player]

Hi Ivconic,

I cannot help with the best circuit mod for audio. But I can tell you that when you use good quality headphones, you will have better response from any audio circuit. I use headphones on my PI detectors and VLF because I find twice as many targets. I rely on headphone sound to determine size and depth of target, and type of metal. I only look at VLF meter when not certain about target. When you use headphones you can hear the very weak signals that sometimes you cannot see on the meters or hear from simple speaker on the box. The headphones will also eliminate most of the outside noise from wind and other sounds. Also I see the batteries are running much longer when I use headphones.

Best wishes,
J_P

[ivconic]

...

Nakky, i was thinking on this resistor...
Also, later add parallel 1M to diode...as KT315 described..
Regards!

[ivconic]

Audio..

I see, at the end we all have success with this nice detector! Bravo!
I took my TGS Light outdoor yesterday, to make some serious tests...
Results are very good...excellent. Same 1cm nickel coin (i mentioned so
many times) it can detect at 27cm in the ground - burried. Very good
results. I am very satisfied.
Dont want to repeat myself oftenly, so this will be all about testing.
Next step:
Next step should be serious improvement of audio stage. I dont want to make
it only louder. Also dont want to add Zahori audio...
I was thinking to find proper way to add vco audio.
Have you ever tried Fisher CZ5 or CZ7?
Do you know how its audio working? Is it only vco or something more?
I have Jackdetect's schematics of CZ5...but it is hand drawing, pretty sloppy.
I am not sure how to use it or even can i use it with TGS?
Never mind CZ5 audio. I just mentioned it as example.
Is there any schematic of audio stage which will allow us to adjust level of
signal needed to "open" or "close" audio to produce sound or not?

For example,sort of filter or "compressor" with which we can supress or
"reject" weak signals with unknown origin and pass only good, known signals
to audio stage.
I have Troy Shadow X3. Most favorite thing at it (for me) is thing i noticed
many times:
Let's say it will detect coin at 25cm. Audio is very strong and clear (unlike
TGS with weak, mum audio). There is a sort of fast,"double" beep-beep on Troy
when coin moved over coil. How can i explain? My english is not so good, i have
problems to explain this thing.
TGS is working very good, it is so obvious,but main drawback is in audio;same,
monotonous,annoying.....I can not be sure whether small or large coin was detected?
While with Troy i can distinguish almost for sure about coin size or even alloy
according to audio! Of course this need a bit of practice, hours of working with
device...same was when i owned 1266. I could "see" detected item with almost 90%
accuracy relying on audio. There is something "rich" in that audio, which TGS
doesnt have...
Also, when earphones are used on TGS; audio is much stronger but "BLUR"...not
sharp as on Troy or Fisher...Why?
Is there any way,mod,tip,hint so we can improve this at TGS. This should be last
step. If we manage this somehow, TGS will turn to one of the best detectors i have
been seen so far!
I'll wait your opinions.

Where is KT315? He is full of suprises, always! C'mon KT315! Save the day!
And Sean Goddard...? C'mon Sean!
Let's togather make best analogue coin detector ever!
We should call it : "Geotech metal detector"!

P.S.
I was thinking to put 0.01-0.1 coupling capacitors at every supply pin on every ic.
Nets should be shortest possible, between caps and pins, of course!
This should provide extra filtering on ic's. Is it worth it? Any experiences?

P.S.
Max;
"...Hi ivconic,
I think lm339 mod would work great. I have some dubts on TL082 instead of two LM308...
these dubts is related to hi-fi audio circuits experiments I've made with dual op.
amps... never get good results where there dual pramp... and expecially TL0x2 series...
but they aren't preamp there."

Yes Max, i know what do you mean! In the past, i made a lot of preamplifiers...some
for guitars, some distortions,wah-wah's etc....Already used TL082 so many times.
TL082 can be meticolous from case to case. Instead working good it can produce
bedlam of noises....mostly depends of surrounding components.
I was thinking; the only replacement for LM308 turns to be TL081a...and when you
put two of them togather, what do you get? TL082...
Maybe i am wrong, but i think TL082 would do the job just fine. I would like to
avoid LM308 in next detectors cose it is a bit obsolete,expensive and mostly very
hard to find in local shops.....
I'll make one and experiment a bit. Later will report here....

[nakky]

Max do you see it

[Nihil Roma Maius]

So do I. But difference between me and you is that I don't sell SNAKE OIL as light.

But, I think you really miss much other "experts" that were ridiculized here cause of crappy thinking and snake-oil companies support and selling... and all we know who they are. Call Damaso to join the team if you feel alone!
Or are just you Mr. Damaso , hiding back the imperial stamp ???
What a huge number of south american business ruined all that LRL fakes talking here !!??

I don't advertise anything, don't try to sell anything, just share my opinions with others and just to learn and for fun cause I'm an entusiast TH and MD owner.

I don't need to sell LRL-dreams (or nightmares) to live. Like someone else do here... but that's fine, you keep stay in business.

You could sell to belivers your stuff, your BS, whatever... but don't try to put me at same level of you and others belonging to the LRL-tribe.

We are not the same.

* * * * * * * * *

Who tell you I sell devices? CRAZY!!! First prejudice, you're blind!

I don't sell any LRL device, also I'm enthusiast like you, so you're bad informed, YOU'RE CONFUSED.

No need to be of the Third World, your malicious and poisonus style is characteristics of bad person.

If you use this down language in your IW, I prefer stay in the IIIW, here in SA.

Psss! Max, do you can build correct coils?

[Max]

I'm on the way...


PS: do you see the RED tantalium cap ?

[Max]

Thanks Max.
Yes, my connections were wrong (shame on me), and this means that my coils were tx and rx signal with the coil and of course the foil (WRONG). Now i m shure that the signal is tx and rx the rigth way, and the shield is really working has it was design (shielding).
I don´t know if i ll have the time to work today on golden sabre, but saturday for shure i ll. Weather for this weekend looks fine, so after i get the 22 cms coil working, i will go outside to make some field test.
ohh i forgot, when you place a coin close to one side of the coils, is it normal to detect it? i ask this because when i connected the coil the wrong way, all kinds of coins that where close to one side of the coil, were detected and this confirm my idea that the tx signal was radiated by the coil and also the shield.

Best regards and thanks to all for helpping me to get this nice machine working.

Nelson

Hi Nelson,
when you near some metal object to coil (not only DD type) and your magnetic field is unbalanced you get signal from detector, so it's normal having sound also on sides, but at very close distance and with enough umbalance due to target. But in DD the most senvitive portion is just under overlapping zone (in the middle). So you can e.g. on the field "pinpoint" targets , when have multiple sounds also on edges, just raising coil a bit to make side signals disappear, then using middle of coil to find exact "line" where target is.

On BandidoII there's another additional choice... one could push the auto-tune to "set" a minimum level of detection, then pinpoint with little movements (very good on concentric open centre coils).

Best regards,
Max

[nelson]

Thanks Max.
Yes, my connections were wrong (shame on me), and this means that my coils were tx and rx signal with the coil and of course the foil (WRONG). Now i m shure that the signal is tx and rx the rigth way, and the shield is really working has it was design (shielding).
I don´t know if i ll have the time to work today on golden sabre, but saturday for shure i ll. Weather for this weekend looks fine, so after i get the 22 cms coil working, i will go outside to make some field test.
ohh i forgot, when you place a coin close to one side of the coils, is it normal to detect it? i ask this because when i connected the coil the wrong way, all kinds of coins that where close to one side of the coil, were detected and this confirm my idea that the tx signal was radiated by the coil and also the shield.

Best regards and thanks to all for helpping me to get this nice machine working.

Nelson

Hi Nelson,
fine, so maybe was that the mistake on lead connections. The gain of depth is a good indicator that you're on the right way.
Keep testing... I know that sometimes could be a stress make lot of mods on coils, wound many etc but it's only way to get them work and really useful to make MD builder experience and skills. I think you'll get good results at the end.

Best regards,
Max

[Max]

Well, Max: I read all you teach here. Ask why real expert in MD don't make any intervention or discussion in this thread managed by you. But I respect Ivconic and Sasho because they are not only theorethicals, but professionals! Also I respect the others because they expect few light...

I miss Bbsailor, R. Sniff and other real capos.

Explain me why you use here soft language (in your expertise) but in terra incognita electronic LRL (not of your speciality) you use a low language...

Hey guys, take care!

Nihil Roma Maius

Hi,
this thread is not "managed" by me, I haven't started it and are here just to exchange informations and give some hints to guys that need few help doing GSabre.

"Ask why real expert in MD don't make any intervention or discussion in this thread managed by you."

so I'm not ? Ok, if you say that, I have to trust you!
Well, I don't know why they don't post here... maybe aren't interested in GSabre, who knows ? If that's your problem ask them direcly!
I'm not a GURU or medium... and can't find/know stuff using ultra-science for detection...

"But I respect Ivconic and Sasho because they are not only theorethicals, but professionals! Also I respect the others because they expect few light..."

So do I. But difference between me and you is that I don't sell SNAKE OIL as light.

"I miss Bbsailor, R. Sniff and other real capos."
These are great experts! Right!

But, I think you really miss much other "experts" that were ridiculized here cause of crappy thinking and snake-oil companies support and selling... and all we know who they are. Call Damaso to join the team if you feel alone!
Or are just you Mr. Damaso , hiding back the imperial stamp ???
What a huge number of south american business ruined all that LRL fakes talking here !!??

"Explain me why you use here soft language (in your expertise) but in terra incognita electronic LRL (not of your speciality) you use a low language...

Hey guys, take care!"

Explain what ? I have to explain nothing here... but maybe you have to.

I don't advertise anything, don't try to sell anything, just share my opinions with others and just to learn and for fun cause I'm an entusiast TH and MD owner.

I don't need to sell LRL-dreams (or nightmares) to live. Like someone else do here... but that's fine, you keep stay in business.

You could sell to belivers your stuff, your BS, whatever... but don't try to put me at same level of you and others belonging to the LRL-tribe.

We are not the same.

Best regards,
Max

[Nihil Roma Maius]

Well, Max: I read all you teach here. Ask why real expert in MD don't make any intervention or discussion in this thread managed by you. But I respect Ivconic and Sasho because they are not only theorethicals, but professionals! Also I respect the others because they expect few light...

I miss Bbsailor, R. Sniff and other real capos.

Explain me why you use here soft language (in your expertise) but in terra incognita electronic LRL (not of your speciality) you use a low language...

Hey guys, take care!

Nihil Roma Maius

[Max]

Hi Max.
Ok, i think i found the problem with my coils. My connections to pcb were wrong. The leads that came from both shields of the coils, were connected not to GND on the board. In other words connections on the pcb were inverted for both coils. So yesterday i connected rigth and after that i tested my first coil that is not well made (3.4 mH and 4.2 mH; 16 ohms and 19 ohms, 22 cms diameter), but i got better results and gain btw 3 to 6 cms more.
So now i ll connect and null a copy of your 22 cms coil, that has good resistance and inductance values, to see what will be the results.

Regards

Nelson

Hi Nelson,
fine, so maybe was that the mistake on lead connections. The gain of depth is a good indicator that you're on the right way.
Keep testing... I know that sometimes could be a stress make lot of mods on coils, wound many etc but it's only way to get them work and really useful to make MD builder experience and skills. I think you'll get good results at the end.

Best regards,
Max

[nelson]

Hola Detectoman y gracis por tus comentarios.
Bueno la verdad es que hoy puedo decir que he encontrado probablemente la rezon de mis problemas y esta es que ambas bobinas, estaban conectadas a la inversa. Por ejemplo la bobina TX en vez de tener conectado el blindaje a tierra, lo tenía al revés. Lo mismo que la RX.
Por lo tanto, primero veré que ocurre con la nueva bobina que copie de Max, la cual esta bién en todas sus medidas, para luego comentarles al foro mis resultados. De hecho con la primera bobina que arme, he probado y los resultados aumentaron entre 3 a 6 centimetros. Claro que esta bobina no fue bien calculada por lo que sus valores inductivos y resistivos están totalmente fuera de rango.
Saludos y estamos en contacto

Atte.
Nelson

PD:No te puedo traducir por tiempo, ya que estoy en mi trabajo y además no soy muy bueno con el ingles. Solo pequeños textos.

nelson:

lo que dice max es que las bobinas funcionan diferente, mejor o peor, si intercambias sus cables, o sea poniendo uno en donde hiba el otro, o sea cualquier bobina, tambien funciona diferente si le das vuelta a una bobina en cuanto a como esta la otra, tambien funcionan diferente si la de arriba la pones abajo o biceversa, yo veo que tu detector esta funcionando bien solo tienes una pequna falla la que yo creo no esta en las bobinas sino en algun ic que no se acopla a los demas, mira yo he hecho circuitos con dualopamps, y de diferentes substitutos funcionan bastante diferente, tienes razon en agotar las pruebas en las bobinas pero ya has hecho bastantes, y si pudiera ser tambien el tipo de cable blindado que estas usando en la conexion, algunos blindajes son de acero y otros traen aluminio esto pudiera obstruir el funcionamiento ideal, yo creo que deberias preguntar a ivconic para que mande una foto del cable que el usa, y ver si puedes conseguirlo igual, de todos modos deberias probar con cables sueltos para ver la diferencia
no creo que el problema este en los coils, yo tambien creo que tu frecuencia no esta de acuerdo a la otra, en ese caso necesitaras compensar un poco probando algunos condensadores diferentes en paralelo con lo que son las salidas puntales del trasmisor, junto a las bobinas o sea ponerlas en paralelo, asi darias un poco mas alta la frecuencia la que elevaria el alcance en aire y por supuesto no fuera demasiada para no penetrar en la tierra, ya que frecuencia demasiado alta da mucho alcance en el aire pero ya en la tierra es ineficaz
lo que tiene tu detector no es una gran falla solo es ponerlo a punto
de hecho ya esta funcionando, y siendo tu apenas principiante pues es un enorme avance
no pierdas la calma y toma largos descansos, para que te despejes, y no te centres demasiado en ese detector, no tomes decisiones precipitadas y revisa una y otra vez detenidamente los valores del circuito, cualquier diferencia en algun componente marcaria la diferencia, en cuanto a que una bobina no este dando los ohmios iguales que los de ivconic, solo es cosa que aumentes o disminuyas soldando otro pedazo de alambre de cobre, asi podras poner las medidas incluso con fracciones intermedias
pregunta a ivconic que corrientes salen en sus puntas hacia el coil, del trsm y del recept, y veras que habra diferencia entre las tuyas y las de el, entonces sabras donde anda el error
pero para eso deberas poner las mismas baterias que ivconic, sino te dara lecturas muy diferentes
te mando un abrazo y te felicito por tus logros y tu gran empeno
toma tu tiempo distraete un poco
yo no estoy haciendo ese detector yo estoy enfocado en otros experimentos, por ejemplo simplificaciones sobre otros detectores, sobre bfos, sobre dos cajas, y sobre vlf muy sencillos, y no dare los resultados hasta que tenga los mejores logros
por favor si tienes tiempo de traducir esto, ya que navego con una pc prestada, la mia ya se dano

detectoman

[nelson]

Hi Max.
Ok, i think i found the problem with my coils. My connections to pcb were wrong. The leads that came from both shields of the coils, were connected not to GND on the board. In other words connections on the pcb were inverted for both coils. So yesterday i connected rigth and after that i tested my first coil that is not well made (3.4 mH and 4.2 mH; 16 ohms and 19 ohms, 22 cms diameter), but i got better results and gain btw 3 to 6 cms more.
So now i ll connect and null a copy of your 22 cms coil, that has good resistance and inductance values, to see what will be the results.

Regards

Nelson

Hi Nelson,
(used the zoom) yes they are! But I said to try reversing leads at rx... I mean that before you have to disconnect the lead connected to gnd wire and use the other with gnd, then the (now) free one alone to the circuit: swap the rx leads at coil level.

Picture is right but doesn't say you nothing about start and finish of rx coil.

Best regards,
Max